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iPhone 4: The Forbidden Grip

Steve Jobs wants to keep you happy by giving you a free case for his company's defective iPhone 4.  (Source: ArsTechnica)
"Phones aren't perfect" -- Steve Jobs

Today at Apple's 1 p.m. EST, 10 a.m. PST press conference, Apple finally formally addressed the iPhone 4's faulty antenna, which its engineers reportedly warned it about last year, but it ignored.  Despite reports claiming that it might initiate a recall, Apple took a hard line, with most of its presentation boiling down to one word -- denial.  But to Apple's credit it is giving users a free bumper case and letting them return their phones for free within 30 days if they're still unhappy.

Apple CEO Steven P. Jobs who infamously told users "You're holding it wrong" took the stage and began by stating, "We're not perfectPhones aren't perfect either... But we want to make all of our users happy.  We love making our users happy.  We're going to talk about how we're going to do that today... but before we get into that I want to talk about the problems and the data we've got so that we can make sure we make all our users happy."

Jobs then turned to a bit of bragging -- a record 3 million iPhone 4s sold in only 3 weeks.  He described it as the best smart phone in history, saying reviews back him up on that.

He then commented, "We started getting some reports of people having issues with the antenna system..People were touching this spot here.  Seeing a large drop in bars... sicne dubbed Antennagate.  We heard about this just 22 days ago from today. It's not like Apple's had its head in the sand for 3 months on this... Apple is an engineering driven company."

He then turned to tests which Apple engineers conducted.  He claims those tests show similar drops in signal, based on hand grip with a Blackberry, the HTC Droid Eris, and the Samsung Omnia 2.  Jobs' conclusion?  "This is life in the smartphone world. Phones aren't perfect."

Of course Jobs failed to show a wide variety of smart phones -- such as the HTC EVO 4G, Droid Incredible, etc.

He again reaffirms his stance that users need to be sure to have the correct grip and that the problem is mostly imagined stating, "We went to a lot of trouble to put this beautiful line in the stainless steel to say here's where you touch it everybody... and we had incorrect bars, so when it did drop the drop looked far more catastrophic."

Apple says that its testing to come to this conclusion was extensive.  It spent $100M USD on its signal testing facility, complete with anechoic chambers.  It has hired 18 PhD scientist and engineers (though earlier reports indicate it perhaps wasn't listening to them).

In his presentation, Jobs cites AppleCare numbers which he claims indicate that only 0.55 percent of customers had enough of an issue to contact Apple.  Further, he says that return rates on the iPhone 4 are a miniscule 1.7 percent down from 6 percent (granted maybe some customers were waiting for Apple's response).

Jobs did admit that the iPhone 4 drops more calls that the iPhone 3GS, but claims that it only drops 1 more call per 100 calls than the 3GS hardware -- in other words less than a 1 percent difference.  He claims his inbox has been overflowing with emails telling him how wonderfully the iPhone 4 is working and how great it is.  In fact he claims he received 5,000 such emails.

He concludes by summarizing about the cosmetic "fix" to the number of bars drawn.  And then finally, he tosses customers a bone.  Apple will be giving out a free cases (Apple's own $30 USD newly designed case which reportedly fixes much of the signal problems or similar third party designs).  Until Sept. 30 Apple will give one of the cases to every iPhone 4 purchaser for free.  Customers who already bought a case will be refunded.  And international customers will be eligible for the offer as well.

The proximity sensor issue was also briefly mentioned, and chief Jobs says a software fix is incoming.  He also reminded that the white iPhone 4 will arrive at the end of July and that the iPhone 4 will launch in 17 countries on July 30th, as well.

The conference wraps up with Jobs commenting, "We love our users.  We try very hard to surprise and delight them.. we work our asses off and we have a blast doing it.  What motivates us is to have them love our products.  We also connect them with great apps and content.  We love our users so much we've built 300 apple retail stores for them.  When we fall short we try harder."

"And when we succeed they reward us by staying our users... so that's what drives us. And when we have problems like this and people are criticizing us, we take it really personally. Maybe we shouldn't, but we do.  We all read these stories and we take it seriously.  We think we've gotten to the heart of the problem, and the heart is that smartphones have weak spots. And so for those small number of customers that are having problems, we're going to give them cases, and for those that are still unhappy we're going to give them a full refund.   But the data supports the fact that the iPhone 4 is the best smartphone in the world, and that there is no antennagateAnd that's what I had to present to you today."

A class action lawsuit on the problems is pending.

All Mr. Jobs' quotes were taken from this live feed from the company's press conference.

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Was called
By dflynchimp on 7/16/2010 2:02:51 PM , Rating: 4
Quote Shatbot:
It's obvious - on Friday Steve is going to say they had some unexpected problems with the antenna in a small amount of phones, and that the bar system will be made more accurate. Then if you take your iPhone 4 with receipt into any Apple store you'll get a free bumper. If not I'll eat my hat. He'll look the hero, and everyone will be so stoked about how good Apple is at looking after their customers. If anyone goes to the conference can someone PLEASE yell out about the hacked iTunes accounts? The annoying this is he also gets to use it as another advert. Bastard.

man it's like we DT commenters can do some majr forecasting haha.

RE: Was called
By stimudent on 7/16/10, Rating: -1
RE: Was called
By dflynchimp on 7/16/2010 2:08:26 PM , Rating: 1
if you read the article you'd know they ARE offering said refund if you ask for it.

Of course id doesn't excuse Apple from its moronic backtracking and self-righteous denial of the initial problem before escalation.

RE: Was called
By quiksilvr on 7/16/2010 2:25:25 PM , Rating: 5
That's what made the media go nuts. It wasn't the problem, it was how they responded to it.

Why didn't they just say this:
"We are aware of the problem concerning iPhone 4's antenna. As of now, we are working on a possible software fix. If the problem cannot be fixed via a software solution, we will then focus on a hardware solution for our current and future iPhone 4 customers. All was ask for is some patience until we can figure out the best solution to this problem. Thank you."

AND THEN THE MEDIA WOULD STFU. But NOOOOOOOOOO! You had to take the circle jerk route:
1) Youtube video showing a fanboy telling how awesome we are and how much we have Gizmodo!
2) Our phone is the best.
3) Only 1/2 a percent have a problem.
4) Other smartphones have the problem too.
5) We love our users. We try very hard to surprise & delight them. We love our users. Macs, iPods, iPhones, iPads, Apple TV, App Store,...We love our users. We connect them with great Apps and content. We love our users. They reward us by staying our users...creepy much?

RE: Was called
By Dorkyman on 7/16/2010 9:37:19 PM , Rating: 3
This conference will be discussed for years as an example of what NOT to do when a product defect is discovered.

As an aside, it didn't take long for the long knives to come out. Here's a bit of commentary about Nokia's response today:

"...Nokia's looking to ride the mojo of any negative fallout from today's Apple press conference, slipping out a rather fascinating statement this afternoon. The gist of it is that Espoo's keen on letting everyone know how much blood, sweat, and tears they've poured into perfecting their antenna design strategy over the years, going so far as to say that they "prioritize" it over the physical design of the phone if they need to in order to optimize its call performance -- an opinion moderately different from the "we want to have our cake and eat it too" philosophy espoused by Jobs today. In closing, Nokia acknowledges that a "tight grip" can mess with the performance, though they say they've done a bunch of research on the ways their phones are typically held so that the antennas are placed optimally..."

RE: Was called
By mstrmac on 7/17/10, Rating: -1
RE: Was called
By Proxes on 7/16/2010 2:18:56 PM , Rating: 3
They're not giving bumpers they are giving free cases.

RE: Was called
By aharris on 7/16/2010 2:28:22 PM , Rating: 4
Only because they said they don't have the capacity to produce the bumpers quickly enough.

They're using a 3rd party (likely one of the usual vendors) to produce cases for the phone, will provide a portal on their website where you can select which case you want and order it free of charge (not sure on shipping?) beggining late next week.

They're also refunding the cost of any bumpers and/or cases users have purchased (or will purchase), and that stipulation may continue until September 30th.

RE: Was called
By bfellow on 7/16/2010 3:20:31 PM , Rating: 5
The phone's fine but have a free case and we'll fix that proximity sensor bug. It drops more calls than the 3GS but the antenna is better!

RE: Was called
By Proxes on 7/16/2010 3:28:54 PM , Rating: 5
Kinda makes you wonder about all those years of people blaming AT&T for dropping calls and it's been the phones all this time!

RE: Was called
By qkool on 7/16/2010 11:58:18 PM , Rating: 2
Has AT&T said anything about this, or are they still soaking the blame?

RE: Was called
By dark matter on 7/17/2010 11:30:31 AM , Rating: 2
If you have problem with iPhone, you are the problem.

The glorious iPhone. Long live the iPhone. Viva la iPhone.

It's worth starting a revolution over.

RE: Was called
By icanhascpu on 7/18/2010 4:09:53 PM , Rating: 1
Yeah the iPhone 4 drops 100% MORE calls than the 3GS!

Nevermind that its 2 in 100 vs 1 in 100.

RE: Was called
By Shatbot on 7/16/2010 3:47:33 PM , Rating: 5
Well I'm happy: I like my hat.

RE: Was called
By Anoxanmore on 7/16/2010 4:49:48 PM , Rating: 5
See you need a modified princess bride quote now:

So without further ado!

The Consumer: That Stevie, he can *fuss*.
AT&T: Fuss, fuss... I think he like to scream at *us*.
The Consumer: Probably he means no *harm*.
AT&T: He's really very short on *charm*.
The Consumer: You have a great gift for rhyme.
AT&T: Yes, yes, some of the time.
Stevie: Enough of that.
The Consumer: Fezzik, are there rocks ahead?
FAT&T: If there are, we all be dead.
Stevie: No more rhymes now, I mean it.
AT&T: Anybody want a peanut?

RE: Was called
By pwndcake on 7/16/2010 10:49:06 PM , Rating: 5
Steve: It's magical!
Consumer: You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

RE: Was called
By NanoTube1 on 7/16/10, Rating: -1
RE: Was called
By alifbaa on 7/16/10, Rating: -1
RE: Was called
By NanoTube1 on 7/16/10, Rating: -1
RE: Was called
By priusone on 7/17/2010 3:40:37 AM , Rating: 2
Patent trolls and Apple. Those are the only two types of drama that I allow into my life. Patent trolls are allowed to do their thing thanks to government regulations. I have lefty acquaintances who have Apple products, so stuff like this just adds fuel to a well lit fire. And as an avid camper, I make sure that the fire stays hot.

RE: Was called
By Senju on 7/20/2010 12:33:51 AM , Rating: 2
I have to agree!
If you put your iphone in a Microwave and then complain you are not getting signals, are you really going to blame Apple?
People need to take more responsibility on how they use products. With some command sense, I believe you can avoid such drop calls.
<Is there room for me to get into the bunker too?>

RE: Was called
By xaders on 7/16/2010 7:12:24 PM , Rating: 4
deep down, steve jobs blame the mass media. iphone 4 has no problem judging by most of the presentation. 5,000 customers email saying it is the greatest phone ever & probably (0.55 % of 3 million customers) is 16,500 customers email that they had antenna issue.

in the end, it is not a recalled & apple answer iphone criticism

RE: Was called
By Broken on 7/17/2010 12:03:59 AM , Rating: 2
What I find funny, I have never noticed any reception problem by holding any of my smartphones I have had on AT&T, AT&T branded or imported. And yes I have had an iPhone and I have had many WM and Android phones. Guess my area has awesome coverage....

Nah, Jobs is just douche.

RE: Was called
By Alexvrb on 7/18/2010 2:40:06 PM , Rating: 2
I've got an Omnia 2 that say's he's full of crap. I can hold it any way I want, and the signal is fine.

RE: Was called
By callmeroy on 7/20/2010 10:28:51 AM , Rating: 2
I have a Samsung touch screen phone (the model number is under the battery cover and I'm too lazy to get it to check right now) ...doesn't matter how i grip the phone works fine with the same high signal strength either way.

I don't know if my phone is really a "smart phone" though...I can watch video, surf the web, send email and there are some games and basic apps like calendar, calculator, etc. but that's about it.

Either way its mind boggling to me that you drop hundreds on a new phone and the company that makes says you have to hold it a certain way or else -- essentially it doesn't work right...

RE: Was called
By Newspapercrane on 7/17/2010 12:32:21 AM , Rating: 5
Jobs said that 0.55 percent of users have called about antenna/reception issues... There would have been more, but they couldn't get enough bars. :D

RE: Was called
By Azure Sky on 7/20/2010 12:17:04 PM , Rating: 1

I gave up my votes on this topic just to say this needs a +6!!!!

RE: Was called
By jonup on 7/20/2010 2:43:06 PM , Rating: 2

Steve oh Steve...
By MrBlastman on 7/16/2010 2:03:37 PM , Rating: 5
I present to you a new concept, the i-Lie™, as Steve himself has been told to exude a "reality distortion field." What a piece of work, here are a couple of great quotes:

Q: Any changes for future antenna designs in iPhone?
A: Steve: We’re still working on this — we’re happy with the design. … we’re getting a lot of reports from customers that it’s way better than the 3GS. I don’t know what our next antenna design will be — maybe our wizards in the antenna lab will come up with something better. But looking at the data, we don’t think we have a problem.


“But the data supports the fact that the iPhone 4 is the best smartphone in the world, and there is no ‘Antennagate,’ but there is a challenge to the entire industry. Today, we love our customers and we’re going to take care of them.”

Deny, Deny, Deny, Deny. There is NO problem, huh Steve, yet, you still provide this case that you originally charged people 30 dollars for for free now to shut them up? Wait, there wouldn't be all this fuss if there actually wasn't a problem! Sooooo, there must be one, yet, Steve, you continue to live in your "reality distorition field" and try to deny everything hoping this little "gesture" of Apple "goodwill" will make everyone happy.

I can't say I'm not suprised. There is no way I woke up this morning expecting him to admit there is a problem and issue a recall--a recall would be the proper thing to do here.

Everyone, look towards the next few months when a new revision of the phone comes out after the end of September, a quiet revision that addresses the problem without doing the right thing and fixing everyone's phone.

RE: Steve oh Steve...
By Hieyeck on 7/16/2010 3:41:28 PM , Rating: 4
I reject your reality and substitute my own!

RE: Steve oh Steve...
By pwndcake on 7/16/2010 10:51:03 PM , Rating: 2
I disbelieve!

Now roll vs WIS.

RE: Steve oh Steve...
By magreen on 7/18/2010 9:40:53 AM , Rating: 2
This is not the AntennaGate you're looking for.

RE: Steve oh Steve...
By Azure Sky on 7/20/2010 12:20:29 PM , Rating: 1
ROFL......good one!!! vote this guy up to a little geek humor is a good thing :D

RE: Steve oh Steve...
By ChristopherO on 7/16/2010 6:12:19 PM , Rating: 5
“But the data supports the fact that the iPhone 4 is the best smartphone in the world, and there is no ‘Antennagate,’"

I love the fact he said that, maybe 5 minutes after he admitted it dropped more calls than the 3GS.

And he got 5,000 emails from people who loved their phones? I have no doubt that Jobs could drive over everyone's pet and 5,000 people would be crazy enough to write him and thank him for "offing" fluffy.

RE: Steve oh Steve...
By FishTankX on 7/17/10, Rating: -1
RE: Steve oh Steve...
By ChristopherO on 7/18/2010 11:34:51 AM , Rating: 2
You seem to be adhering to "new math".

It drops 1 more call per hundred. However, if the average AT&T call-drop rate is 3.7 per 100, then 4.7 per hundred means that the iPhone 4 drops calls ~30% more often than an average phone. Jobs apparently can't do math because this is not less than a "1% increase".

Then there is this article:

So I suppose if it drops 31 calls out of 100 instead of 30 in NYC, that's not a big deal.

And then this WSJ article:

It quotes the other CEOs that they used their phones for comparison.

This is particularly good:
Motorola Inc. co-CEO Sanjay Jha said, "Antennas on the outside of products have known issues, and despite the fact that they lead to smaller phones we have avoided them because consumers don't like being told how to hold the phone."

I also like this one:
A Nokia Corp. spokeswoman said antenna performance "may be affected with a tight grip, depending on how the device is held." She added, "that's why Nokia designs our phones to ensure acceptable performance in all real-life cases, for example when the phone is held in either hand."

I'm not sure the implication... Perhaps iPhone users should hang their phones from a string in the middle of the room and use bluetooth headsets as to avoid touching them?

RE: Steve oh Steve...
By djc208 on 7/19/2010 9:26:33 AM , Rating: 2
That also helps to hide the magnitude of the issue in general. "It only drops 2 in 100 calls" doesn't sound horrible until you understand how many millions of calls iPhone people are making every day. So in any given second how many iPhone users are going to have a call dropped? I'd bet the number could be over 100.

It's not: of every 100 calls you make on an iPhone 4, 2 will be dropped, it's of every 100 calls started on an iPhone 4 at any given time 2 will be dropped.

Then there's the 5000 e-mails of how wonderful the phone is, when Jobs himself talked about the 3 million they've sold. Which by my math means about 0.2% of the people who bought one loved it enough to e-mail him on how great a phone it is.

Typical Apple speak, play with the statistics right, leave out certain critical data, and you can seem to prove just about any claim.

RE: Steve oh Steve...
By Wulf145 on 7/17/2010 3:50:05 AM , Rating: 2
The Journalists were hand picked on the basis that they were loyal to Apple and were sure to report anything said in a positive light, so what do you expect?

Personally I have no idea why the Media is so in love with this Company, but they are. This is why I see such a discrepancy between what I read about Apple Products and what I see by those friends which have those Products.

RE: Steve oh Steve...
By jamesjwb on 7/18/2010 8:14:00 AM , Rating: 2
Something at least worth factoring in: When an Apple story of any kind can get 20 million zillion page views and it was only about a boring patent application, you get at least one reason why the media might love this company.

By Daniel8uk on 7/16/2010 2:35:32 PM , Rating: 5
I don't know what is worse, this blithering idiot who is in blatant-blinkers-enabled-fixated-on-absolute-denial -mode or the idiotic sheep who listen to this arrogant man and believe every word he says, even if those words directly contradict what has been said in the past by his own company and also not forgetting the very important scientific facts (!!) gained by doing tests on the phones aerial design.

I think this is a very good example of an phenomenon of our society, that is that people will quite easily sit twinkled-eyed while some one dictates to them what is the truth, and only truth, regardless of what the people being dictated to actually know.

But, does it really matter, Apple are allowing the phone to be returned 'freely' in the 30 day return policy, which, um is free anyway, and oh yes a free bumper case, wow!, I mean, come on guys and girls stand up and give this man a round of applause, this great man has just cut into his companies profits to offer you lucky people a free product. Sadly a number of Chinese workers will have to be horse whipped to death before we get the full 3 million+ free bumpers, but that is a very small price to pay for our happiness.

RE: I...
By FATCamaro on 7/16/10, Rating: -1
RE: I...
By nidomus on 7/16/2010 4:50:30 PM , Rating: 2
No... they're made in Taiwan

RE: I...
RE: I...
By dark matter on 7/17/2010 11:29:27 AM , Rating: 1
Oh, you may want to know that Apple are not subsidising the Chinese workers like they said they would. Foxconn is footing the bill still.

RE: I...
By frobizzle on 7/16/2010 5:07:54 PM , Rating: 5
I don't know what is worse, this blithering idiot who is in blatant-blinkers-enabled-fixated-on-absolute-denial -mode or the idiotic sheep who listen to this arrogant man and believe every word he says, even if those words directly contradict what has been said in the past by his own company and also not forgetting the very important scientific facts (!!) gained by doing tests on the phones aerial design.

So in other words, who's the more foolish? The fool or the fool who follows him?

RE: I...
By jamesjwb on 7/18/2010 8:22:38 AM , Rating: 2
Well, average Joe types aren't exactly the most logical bunch. They tend to get far too used to being told what to think - in this case either by opinionated blog posts or by Jobs himself. Thankfully Most of us tech-types can pull this apart to a nice, even balance...

...Job's is f**kin' insane!

smart money
By tastyratz on 7/16/2010 2:42:45 PM , Rating: 5
It spent $100M USD on its signal testing facility, complete with anechoic chambers. It has hired 18 PhD scientist and engineers

All that, and some idiot on youtube on the first day figures out the simplest flaw to possibly exist.

RE: smart money
By Helbore on 7/16/2010 3:45:17 PM , Rating: 5
That's because they spent all the money on making the facility out of a single sheet of machined aluminium with chrome highlights and added geebees, instead of spending any on the actual hardware.

RE: smart money
By Azure Sky on 7/20/2010 12:37:06 PM , Rating: 1
I think a requirement for becoming a product engineer at apple is feeling form is far more important then function, I mean look at all their designs.......they sell on the "shiney" factor.

By VenomSymbiote on 7/16/2010 2:08:15 PM , Rating: 5
" is an engineering driven comepany."

Shouldn't that say marketing driven company?

RE: Hmm...
By wiz220 on 7/16/2010 3:02:13 PM , Rating: 3
LOL, I had the exact same reaction when I read that! Steven P. Jobs just blew my mind man! :)

RE: Hmm...
By Azure Sky on 7/20/2010 12:43:21 PM , Rating: 1
this also needs a +6

By sapiens74 on 7/16/2010 4:36:09 PM , Rating: 2
Due to its absolutely awful battery life when using Wifi+Exchange?

By bfellow on 7/16/2010 5:09:13 PM , Rating: 2
No one remembers the unveiling of the iPhone4 conference?

"Everyone stop using Wifi!"

- Steve Jobs at iPhone 4 revealing.

By transamdude95 on 7/16/2010 5:28:50 PM , Rating: 4
He was holding it wrong.

By Azsen on 7/17/2010 1:05:52 AM , Rating: 1
It's not like they had a fibre connection to the net for all those 200+ WiFi users, of course it's going to be overloaded.

By seamonkey79 on 7/17/2010 12:37:12 AM , Rating: 3
My Eris had no trouble, and while my Incredible shows fewer bars than the Eris did, it does so at the same signal strength that the Eris was showing more bars (sounds the same as what Apple just did), and I dropped one call in the three months I've owned the Incredible, and that was when I was in the middle of my steel and concrete warehouse surrounded by cardboard boxes full of paper.

RE: Hmm.
By Dradien on 7/17/2010 1:59:53 AM , Rating: 3
I have a Droid Eris. Here are some signal strength numbers...

Sitting on my table without case on : -78
Sitting on my table with case on : -79
Cupped in both my hands without case : -101
Cupped in both my hands with case : -101
Held like I would hold it in a call (lefty) : -87
Held like a goddamn monkey while in a call : -90 to -95

In every situation, I am still able to send a receive voice and data without a problem (Although speed while laying down was 2000kb/s, and cupped was around 1k, so about half).

My eris has NO problem when it's being held in any way.

Love that picture!
By amanojaku on 7/16/2010 2:09:09 PM , Rating: 5
t's not like Apple's had its head in the sand for 3 months on this
No, Apple's had its head up your ass, Steve, and it's time to pull it out. This is really unacceptable.

iEmperor Steve
By WldAntc on 7/16/2010 2:30:19 PM , Rating: 5
iEngineer: Well, actually the iDeathStar is almost invincible... there's this one little spot on the lower left side
*magical lightning zap*
iEmperor: As I was saying, this spot is common to all DeathStars but research shows no one is Rebel enough to really care. In fact, it so not a problem; we're heroically giving away free bumper shields...
*magical mind trick* This isn't the problem you're looking for

The real question is...
By 67STANG on 7/16/2010 2:29:30 PM , Rating: 2
Does the bumper that they're giving away reduce cellular reception? I worked in RF for about 3 years and found that signal strength is *very* touch when it comes to obstructions. Since they are utilizing the stainless band around the phone as part of the antennae system, wouldn't it be prudent to assume that it is not transparent to RF?

RE: The real question is...
By SpaceJumper on 7/20/2010 10:08:06 AM , Rating: 2
The dielectric of rubber is between 3.2 and 10, which is not good for RF cellular frequency. The rubber band is a patch up fix; Apple just lucked out so far. The antenna impedance matching messed up big time, it is actually worse to transmit than to receive, the signal-bars are not telling the whole story. If you test the phone further away from the cell towers then signal will drop again even with the bumper case.
Connecting the antenna to the steel band and in contact with the skin is a bad idea. It is almost funny to think that how could the antenna design went through the preliminary and critical designs reviews.
Apple could be testing other phones in an EMI chamber to block most of the signals. I know people using the Blackberry 9700 without transmit/reception problem.
Apple learned a hard lesson; Apple will be more cautious next time.

Hubris, anyone?
By xprojected on 7/16/2010 2:49:16 PM , Rating: 2
"We love our users. We try very hard to surprise and delight them.. we work our asses off and we have a blast doing it. What motivates us is to have them love our products. We also connect them with great apps and content. We love our users so much we've built 300 apple retail stores for them. When we fall short we try harder."

In other words - The leader loves us, provides for us, and has built us places of worship! All love the leader!

RE: Hubris, anyone?
By pwndcake on 7/16/2010 10:54:14 PM , Rating: 2
Na-na-na-na-na-na-na-na Leader!


Post 9/30
By Wankel on 7/16/2010 4:51:36 PM , Rating: 2
So what happens after Sept 30th? No free bumper or will the phone be redesigned so no need for a bumper.

RE: Post 9/30
By dark matter on 7/17/2010 11:34:28 AM , Rating: 2
Duh, you then have to buy the bumper to make it work properly or hold it correctly. By then Jobs thinks the media spotlight will have gone and people are stupid enough to have forgotten all this.

There's a new sheriff in town
By vcolon on 7/16/2010 11:41:56 PM , Rating: 2

By retrospooty on 7/17/2010 10:30:36 AM , Rating: 2
to heck with the X, I think the original Moto Droid already beat the stink out of the iPhone, all that screen real estate + a real keyboard, on a better (and open) OS.

It's not just a river in Egypt
By marvdmartian on 7/16/2010 2:08:23 PM , Rating: 2
Man, did I call this one right! Denial, denial, denial....and when they still ask, deny it again! SJ might as well have said, "It's all in your heads!!"

Even when they decided to fix the problem, they did so grudgingly, while still touting their "MAGICAL" product. I wonder if the people who already bought a bumper case will get a full refund? Doubtful!

Oh, and how generous is it of The Mighty One to offer a full refund within 30 days of purchase? Um, wasn't that what AT&T was offering anyways? Nothing quite like giving people what they already had been offered, eh?

smartphones have weak spots
By nafhan on 7/16/2010 2:43:57 PM , Rating: 2
To quote Steve:
the heart is that smartphones have weak spots.
This is the closest he comes to mentioning that the antennas shouldn't be bridged. Still, I'm not really surprised; this is pretty much how I expected it to go.

Our fix - make your iPhone into a rubber!
By Belard on 7/16/10, Rating: 0
By Belard on 7/17/2010 4:58:36 AM , Rating: 2
Something wrong with an opinion and facts?

The iPhone4 looks great with its metal body... the rubber makes it look not so good. But the GOLD-looking tape that Anandtech used for testing looks pretty damn good, but not really usable for everyday.

So... whats the point of making a HOT looking phone that YOU have to buy a rubber for it in order to protect it?

Not much difference in buying those protectors that go on the front nose of a sports car.

By Etern205 on 7/16/2010 4:39:03 PM , Rating: 2
Engadget posted videos where Apple tested out other phones and if you hold in the "death grip" the bars will drop too.

Complete BS!

Rotary Phones are the Best
By hiscross on 7/16/2010 6:51:02 PM , Rating: 2

It just rings until you pick up the receiver or the caller gives up.

Drops 1% more calls ?
By Justin Time on 7/16/2010 7:02:11 PM , Rating: 2
The "norm" for dropped calls in the USA is 1.5 per 100, and that is supposedly the drop rate of the 3GS

So, another 1 per 100 is 1% more ?

Is this iMaths ??

By carigis on 7/16/2010 8:10:41 PM , Rating: 2
anyone notice that apple sort of skipped the part with the Q and A section on the video on thier website. That was the most interesting

Today was a buy day!
By zisel on 7/17/10, Rating: 0
RE: Today was a buy day!
By dark matter on 7/17/2010 11:37:05 AM , Rating: 2
WTF is this?? Of course today was a busy day for you, you're paid to astroturf. I bet you wish you never signed up for the job now eh. Hope you got something decent for selling your soul dude.

By Swedishelk on 7/17/2010 5:00:43 AM , Rating: 2
Who in their right mind buys a phone the size of a PDA? My 30 dollar Nokia phone works just fine and it's tiny. Why do sheeple need an phone that's as powerful as a computer from a few years ago? Go outside get some exercise and see the world.

By Soldier1969 on 7/19/2010 5:14:42 PM , Rating: 2
Yeh Ive had it with Apple now, its been fun but its time to move on! Upgrading my 3GS to a Dell Streak as soon as its announced this week... See ya Apple!

I love it!
By MartyLK on 7/19/2010 8:31:53 PM , Rating: 1
Apple never ceases to please me, especially when it comes to dealing with the Apple hating idiots.

It seems the Apple haters want to humble Apple for no other reason than to bolster their own ego. They may have succeeded with other companies, but Apple is a whole new game. They haven't been able to bring Apple to its knees and it is driving them knuts! This is why Apple continues to grow evermore highly praised. They don't bow down to the foreign bums who want ever other country and society to follow their own values.

Apple is an American company run by the most valued CEO in the world and in history. They cater to the pimply-faced, adolescent, childish "Waa!-Waa!...Apple-won't-do-what-I-want" types.

RIGHT ON! APPLE! Stick it to them! Make them self destruct! Exasperate them till they break!

RE: I love it!
By MartyLK on 7/19/2010 8:38:23 PM , Rating: 1
[CORRECTED] - Apple never ceases to please me, especially when it comes to dealing with the Apple hating idiots.

It seems the Apple haters want to humble Apple for no other reason than to bolster their own ego. They may have succeeded with other companies, but Apple is a whole new game. They haven't been able to bring Apple to its knees and it is driving them knuts! This is why Apple continues to grow evermore highly praised. They don't bow down to the foreign bums who want ever other country and society to follow their own values.

Apple is an American company run by the most valued CEO in the world and in history. They [DON'T] cater to the pimply-faced, adolescent, childish "Waa!-Waa!...Apple-won't-do-what-I-want" types.

RIGHT ON! APPLE! Stick it to them! Make them self destruct! Exasperate them till they break!

Do you know what am i saying?
By ipay on 7/16/2010 3:45:44 PM , Rating: 1
We love our users. We try very hard to surprise and delight them.. we work our asses off and we have a blast doing it.

Im sick of this crap
By dsumanik on 7/16/2010 11:33:33 PM , Rating: 1
Anyone sick of hearing about apple, jobs and iphones yet??

Google should just buy apple and end this misery once and for all, a hostile takeover would be sweet!!!


imagine google controlling ios and android??

We'd wind up with iphones that didnt need to be jailbroken and jobs would be out on his ass... in a matter of months all the major downfalls of dealing with the apple universe would be systematically removed.

Sales would go through the roof.

By YashBudini on 7/19/2010 4:27:54 PM , Rating: 1
Worst break dancing I've ever seen.

So to summarise...
By Tony Swash on 7/16/10, Rating: -1
RE: So to summarise...
By MrBlastman on 7/16/2010 3:00:16 PM , Rating: 5

Tony Swash is an i-Zealot. This is not disputable.


Your blathering means nothing to me, when I read your posts all I hear is Charlie Brown's teacher saying: "Mwa waah waa hwaa waaaa waaaa wa."


There is nothing I can say here that can convince you that Apple is possibly an evil company.


Steve Jobs is an egomaniac.


As much as Google bothers me at times, I really hope they throw Apple under the bus. Steve needs no Olive branch, the only mistake we've all made is letting Apple hang on long enough to get a second wind.

RE: So to summarise...
By Maharajamd on 7/16/10, Rating: -1
RE: So to summarise...
By ebakke on 7/16/10, Rating: -1
RE: So to summarise...
By Ard on 7/16/2010 3:09:24 PM , Rating: 5

1. All smartphones suffer from attenuation. No smartphone suffers from the significant (orders of magnitude) amount of attenuation that the iPhone 4 experiences. Bars do NOT tell you anything about your actual signal strength (read: in dB).

2. Irrelevant and a red herring. No other smartphone manufacturer is experiencing the problems inherent to ONLY the iPhone 4.

3. Unqualified statistics don't mean a damn thing. They're simply thrown about to appease the media and fanboys such as yourself.

4. A free refund within 30 days, which, if I'm not mistaken, is already over for anyone who had their phone shipped for them. Funny how the timing worked out on that one. And a free bumper that completely detracts from the aesthetics Apple themselves promoted and does NOTHING to address the underlying issue. Let's not even get into the incompatibility these things have with accessories.

5. Comprehensive by whose standards? They pulled some unqualified stats out their ass, dodged the few meaningful questions actually asked, and did not offer an admission of culpability.

All in all I'd say they completely fucking failed, which is exactly why I'm going to the Verizon store after work. The Droid Incredible and Droid X are speaking to me. It's a bit hazy but I can make out two words: Fuck...Apple.

RE: So to summarise...
By Tony Swash on 7/16/10, Rating: -1
RE: So to summarise...
By chick0n on 7/17/2010 12:57:22 AM , Rating: 1
another iDiot

First thing I wanna say is --- Nexus One's problem was fixable by Software

your GARBAGE iPhone on the other hand, is NOT software fixable.

Simple proof is that my friend and I, both "pick" our phones up at the same time to make a call, his iPhone 4 couldn't. Mine works. So yeah, thats already enough to proof that iPhone 4 is GARBAGE.

Fanboys like u just wouldn't admit you just paid for a shinny piece of shit.

wow offering a rubber band thats like 50 cents? Big-fxking deal. and u think thats cool ? how many will take the offer? a lot of people like freebies. but guess what fanboy, a lot of people actually don't want the Rubber band cuz it looks f-ing retarded. they would rather have drop calls or "holding it wrong" than try to make the phone actually work like a phone. So giving up "looks" for "functionality", typical Apple Fanboylism.

RE: So to summarise...
By themaster08 on 7/17/2010 2:27:03 AM , Rating: 2
The issues with the iPhone do of course receive vastly more coverage in the media but that's because Apple and the iPhone are newsworthy. Remember - trying to work out what is happening in the world by looking at news headlines is like trying to tell the time by watching the second hand on a clock.

As far as I can see many phones suffer from the same problem as the iPhone 4 and ten minutes on Google turned this lot up:
So out of tens of thousands of mobile phones ever made, you're able to come up with just 6, of which half of those are not even smartphones.

You just said so yourself why this is such a problem.

Did any of those phones sell by the order of magnitude of the iPhone? - No.

Did any of those phones have the public fanfare and media hype of the iPhone? - No.

Did Apple immediately admit and address the issue with respect towards its consumers? No.

The iPhone has been released for a month, and only now do customers get a so-called "fix".

I would have thought it was probably one of the faster and better responses
Apple knew of this issue before the iPhone 4 was even released. That has already been addressed. What was Apple's immediate solution to all of this? Sell a $30 bumper in the hopes that everyone purchases one and therefore suffers no attenuation issues.

Then when these issue comes to light, Apple are mostly quiet, firstly blaming their signal bar formula, and claiming that only a small number of customers are suffering from this issue.

Apple withdrew ever mounting complaints from their forums instead of addressing those customers to tell them that Apple were working on a fix.

Apple claim to have received 15,000+ complaints due to the antenna. That is 10,000 more than those who emailed Jobs to praise the device. So only 1 in 3 people are happy with their iPhone by that logic. Is that an accurate statistic? Of course not.

Nobody knows an exact figure as to how many customers are suffering from this issue.
only 0.55 percent of customers had enough of an issue to contact Apple
That's no indicator whatsoever. My guess is that most of those people will just bend over and take it.

Yet again, Apple's execution for a fix was absolutely abysmal.

It's always the same thing...

Deny the issue even exists - delete complaints from message boards - finally admit to the issue but water it down and use blanket statements to drift away from the actual problem - finally issue fix and forget that it ever happened.

RE: So to summarise...
By avxo on 7/17/10, Rating: -1
RE: So to summarise...
By dark matter on 7/17/2010 11:42:03 AM , Rating: 5
What is signal strength measured in then? Pecans? Cashews?

It's all very well telling people they are wrong without giving the right answer yourself. Especially when you're wrong anyway.

RE: So to summarise...
By avxo on 7/23/2010 6:12:08 PM , Rating: 2
Signal strength is measured in dBm. Not dB. There is a difference between dB and dBm, just like there is a difference between pecans and cashews (to use your reference).


RE: So to summarise...
By The0ne on 7/21/2010 11:43:08 AM , Rating: 2
And it's for those points that Anand's latest review and excuse for Apple is a failure for me. After that review, I truly had to say fck Anand and Brian. What a pair of dickless aholes testers. That's just for the review they did mind you. Anand needs to come back to the engineering side and re-learn what he needs for his company.

RE: So to summarise...
By Fanon on 7/16/2010 3:38:42 PM , Rating: 2
a) I have no doubt smart phones have similar problems, but the keys are:

1) Naturally holding the iPhone 4 radically drops the signal.
2) Apple knew the design was flawed.
3) Apple ran around in circles instead of saying "Hey, you know what? We screwed up"

b) See answer a1 above. The case of iPhone 4 was very different because holding the phone naturally radically degrades signal strength.

e) Only after they were called on the carpet about it. The usual Apple spin was put in motion and users were told to hold it differently.

This was fast? Really? They knew well before release of the problem. The fact that it has taken this long to get any type of honesty out of Apple (and even then it was spun) is ridiculous. A fast response would've been to offer a free case at launch. This was anything but fast.

RE: So to summarise...
By Helbore on 7/16/2010 3:51:37 PM , Rating: 2
Wait, you actually believe the stuff Steve spews?

It's quite simple really, if this issue was no different than any other smartphone, like he claims, he wouldn't have held this press conference and he wouldn't be giving away stuff he could sell instead.

The fact that he stood up there in the first place and then went ahead and offered stuff for free is all the proof you need to know the rest of his statement was marketing BS designed to deflect as much bad publicity as possible.

Only those who pay so little attention would fall for the "but it's not a big deal," line. The whole situation is enough to prove Apple are admitting to this fault's existence.

RE: So to summarise...
By Ard on 7/16/2010 7:17:19 PM , Rating: 5
You're a waste of time and this will be my last post addressing you, no matter what stupidity spills from your thoughts. Here are the facts:

iPhone 4 - 24.6/19.8 db
iPhone 3GS - 14.3/1.9 db
Nexus One - 17.7/10.7 db

Decibels are measured on a logarithmic scale. Let's take the iPhone 3GS vs. iPhone 4 as the example. When gripped, there is a difference of ~10 db in the amount of attenuation the phones experience. Losing 10 db is the equivalent of losing 10x the signal strength. Last time I checked, 10x is an order of magnitude.

It's even worse if you look at the holding naturally comparison. There we're talking about a loss of ~18 db, equivalent to a loss of 63 times the signal strength, rapidly approaching 2 orders of magnitude. The sorry ass phone fares a bit better compared to the Nexus but not by much. The ~7 db difference in attenuation loss is equivalent to a loss of 5x the signal strength and the ~9 db difference is equivalent to a loss of ~8x the signal strength.

I stand by my post. The attenuation the iPhone 4 experiences is exceptionally worse than other phones on the market, approaching and/or exceeding an order of magnitude depending on the comparison.

RE: So to summarise...
By Ard on 7/16/2010 7:18:19 PM , Rating: 2
For whatever reason this reply posted under Helboro. It was meant for Tony Swash, king of Apple fanboys.

RE: So to summarise...
By Tony Swash on 7/16/10, Rating: 0
RE: So to summarise...
By Helbore on 7/17/2010 9:48:39 AM , Rating: 2
No, it really wasn't necessary if there was nothing to address. You make out like its just something that's normal, but it gets massive media coverage just because its Apple. That doesn't really fly with the amount of Apple hardware that doesn't get massive media coverage for tiny defects.

For every article you pull saying it's not a major issue, other people have pulled ten to show that it is. So forgive me for not accepting your evidence over theirs.

Fact remains that if this wasn't an issue and was something that was intrinsic to all phones, Stevie-boy wouldn't be giving away free goods. Face it, he bangs on about how it's only a small issue, all phones have them and they've sold over 3 million iPhone 4s and less than 1% are having a problem - but then goes on to offer free bumpers to every single owner of the iPhone 4.

You don't do that if you don't have to. Businesses don't like flushing money down the toilet. Steve Jobs is not your mate. He isn't about to give you freebies if he could sell you them instead.

He's givng free bumpers to all iPhone 4 owners so that this issue doesn't get spotted by owners who have yet to notice the defect. The longer those recorded instances of this error will crop up and prove that this isn't "sometihng all phones suffer from." That's the only plausible reason to give out free bumpers - because this is a recognised problem that places the device outside of an acceptable operating standard that would make it fit for purpose.

What I don't get is why people defend Steve like he's their best mate. He's not, he's a businessman after your money. He doesn't have your best interests at heart. Of course he's going to lie and big up his own product. That's his job. Why are people like you so blind to that fact? It boggles the mind.

Oh and why do you think those of us who see through Jobs' bull are somehow passionately anti-Apple? Stating a negative aobut a company on a tech-site's message board doesn't make you some pasisonate loon. It just means you are commenting on a story you read.

There's nothing wrong with calling a company to account for its poor practises. Why do Apple fans get their knickers in such a bunch when someone doesn't think that Apple's products are perfect pieces of heaven?

RE: So to summarise...
By KoolAidMan1 on 7/18/2010 6:31:45 AM , Rating: 1
Again I ask why do people who do not intend to buy an iPhone care? It seems perverse. If I did not intend to buy a Toyata I might have an opinion on their product problems and recall but it would be a bit odd if I posted passionately about it. Where would such passion come from. Why does Apple agitate non-Apple buyers so much?

Very simple. Crying about things on internet forums gives some people purpose to an otherwise boring and meaningless existence.

People who expend this much time and energy bashing on Apple products that they do not even own must have sad sad little lives.

RE: So to summarise...
By Helbore on 7/18/2010 10:16:27 AM , Rating: 2
Says the guy who makes no comment about the article, but only bashes posters who's views he disagrees with.

RE: So to summarise...
By KoolAidMan1 on 7/18/2010 5:37:18 PM , Rating: 1
Who said I disagreed with the complaints? My issue is with people who expend so much fanboy energy hating on companies or products that they don't like for whatever reason. You've seen it constantly in pointless XBox 360 vs PS3 debates, you see it in Mac vs PC threads, lots of things.

Again, if you aren't being directly affected by these, and almost none here do judging by the number of people here threads who claim they would never in a million years touch an iPhone, then you are clearly wasting your time.

Tony Swash has one of the most dead-on comments in this thread. I'll say it again, taking this much time and energy to hate on a product you have no intention of owning indicates that you have a boring and meaningless existence and decided to use this to fill up your time.

RE: So to summarise...
By Helbore on 7/18/2010 5:47:39 PM , Rating: 2
Yet you're filling up your time by posting messages about other people you've no likelihood of ever knowing. By your own logic you must have a boring and meaningless existence to be wasting your time like this. Or does it only apply to products you might not buy?

Spenidng five minutes making a post on a tech forum about a tech article is hardly indicitve of an inidivual's quality of life. It seems a bit much to judge anyone who criticises Apple as having no life purely on a post on the internet. All it tells you is that some people have an interest in technology and business.

To make such extreme judgements on such limited information makes your position look much more like character assassination (ie. the age-old Ad Hominem attack) than a genuine, reasoned response.

RE: So to summarise...
By KoolAidMan1 on 7/18/2010 8:21:08 PM , Rating: 1
This all took me under a minute, and it was simply me agreeing with Tony Swash and his post of sanity. Whenever I come by DR comments it is the same peanut gallery posting pages upon pages of the same obvious opinions, wasting time.

That said, you're right, I post any more and I'm starting to devote way too much time to this. Gonna enjoy the rest of this beautiful Sunday.

By ralniv on 7/17/10, Rating: -1
RE: Painful
By Dingmatt on 7/19/2010 4:04:24 AM , Rating: 2
^ Thats some hardcore fanboi lovin'.

Have to admit it does worry me when people can except such flaky explanations/generalisations unquestioningly, Its a brainwashing of sorts.

By Chocobollz on 7/17/2010 5:59:42 AM , Rating: 2
This is why retards shouldn't be allowed on the internet.

I agree. Now, why are you still here? You shouldn't be allowed to use the internet.

By dark matter on 7/17/2010 11:32:46 AM , Rating: 2
Quit the astroturfing. It's as transparent as an iPhone 4 bumber.

By aharris on 7/16/10, Rating: -1
RE: Source?
By guffwd13 on 7/16/2010 3:14:21 PM , Rating: 1
Agreed. And what I truly find funny, is that everyone is playing into the hands of the media for exactly the same reason they are criticizing Apple. Marketing-based yatta yatta yatta. Yes, it is true Apple is really good at market. And the media is really good at being the media. Wake-up people, your making yourselves out to be quite the hypocrites.

RE: Source?
By LumbergTech on 7/16/2010 8:38:13 PM , Rating: 3
you do realize that next to Jason's name in this post it says..BLOG? right?

RE: Source?
By The0ne on 7/21/2010 11:48:43 AM , Rating: 2
Yea, but problem is Jason really believes he's a news reporter and IS writing news, not blogging. Do a search, you be surprise. But hey, it is totally in-line with this discussion! Millions believe in Apple no matter what and Jason believes in his "journlalism" no matter what. Win-win I say :)

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