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Apple CEO Steve Jobs calls his company's new Shanghai store a "landmark in glass engineering."  (Source: Engadget)

iTunes 10 ditches the old icon for a new look.  (Source: Engadget)

Apple also unveiled "Ping" a new Facebook/Twitter-like social network built into iTunes 10.  (Source: Engadget)

Apple TV has shrunk substantially.  (Source: Engadget)

It also comes with a slick new UI that makes it easier to rent movies -- and a "magical" price point of $99 (though Steve Jobs avoided actually using that word to describe the set-top).  (Source: Engadget)
Steve Jobs has plenty to say, hopes to convert new customers and help TV studios "see the light"

The much anticipated September Apple event has come and gone, delivering highlights of the company's retail efforts, information on iTunes 10, and a slew of Apple TV related news.  The biggest surprises?  Apple has launched a social network and it finally has a TV box that seems competitive and compelling. 

Starting the show, Apple made a big-deal at the start of the event about its new stores.  Among the high-profile places where Apple has planted its seed are Paris, France (housed in a restored building); Shanghai, China (featuring a 40-ft tall glass cylinder over the subterranean entrance, which Mr. Jobs calls a "landmark in glass engineering"); and London, England (a "fantastic" store at "the heart of Covent Garden").

Mr. Jobs bragged of some big numbers -- over 1 million visitors at the company's stores daily; over 300 stores in 10 countries, total.  Apple puts on lessons for 80,000 customers a week, a key part of its attempt to convert people to lifetime Mac buyers.

After unveiling its new lineup -- which featured some surprises (the tiny, attractive Shuffle, starting at $49 for 2GB), some disappointments (iPod Nano with iOS and multi-touch but no camera and a smaller screen), and some expected developments (iPhone 4-esque iPod Touch revision) -- Apple turned to iTunes.

The new version of iTunes, iTunes 10 is full of surprises.  First it ditches the old hat logo for a new icon.  The biggest new feature is a brand new, integrated social network called Ping that looks an awful lot like Facebook and helps you network with others to discover music -- and make friends.  Mr. Jobs describes, "It's a social network for music. It's like Facebook and Twitter meet iTunes. It's all about music."

You can "follow" friends in Ping, check out concerts, and post your thoughts.  Apple claims that the network will offer as much privacy as you want, with complete control over who can see/follow you.  Mr. Jobs describes, "You can get as private or as public as you want, and it's super simple to set up."

The new social network is also available via app on iOS devices.  The new version of iTunes will be available today.

Mr. Jobs showed off his own account checking out pictures from Jack Johnson and posting that he was going to a Tegan & Sara/Paramore concert on September 17 in San Jose, California.

Apple does not own the domain name Ping.com -- that distinction is held by a golf club company.  So don't try to visit Apple's new social network from your browser.

As Apple hinted at early in its presentation, it had some big TV developments in store.  Mr. Jobs showed off a slide with Apple TV (introduced in Sept. 2006) which reiterated past critical comments about the device's track record, remarking, "Not a big hit... What have we learned?"

Apparently one thing they learned was that the current product was too big.  In its never ending quest for small, Apple has hacked the new Apple TV down to one quarter its old size -- small enough to grab in your hand.  Its connectivity remains largely the same -- optical audio, HDMI, USB, 802.11n Wi-Fi, and ethernet.

Apple has ditched the old silver case for a black enclosure.  It's also added a new remote.  

So what's there to watch on the sleek new Apple TV?  You can currently rent HD movies on the day of the DVD release for $4.99, unlike Netflix, which makes customers wait a certain number of days for new releases.  Apple, which has offered rentals since 2008, also revealed another compelling new offer -- TV shows for a measly 99¢.  But apparently not everyone is onboard.  Mr. Jobs comments, "Remember, these are commercial free. Now this is a big step for some of the studios to make. So we have ABC and Fox. We think the rest of the studios will see the light."

The new Apple TV rental service features a revamped UI for picking movies.  Its much more graphical and offers reviews from 
Rotten Tomatoes to help you pick the studs from the duds.

The box now can stream Netflix movies, too.  That's somewhat ironic to say the least -- Apple sells streaming video rentals, but in a bid to pick up sales, it's letting its biggest rival Netflix on its set-top box.  Users also have access to content on YouTube, Flickr, and MobileMe.  And to top it off iPad users can push content from their Apple TV to their iPad using a technology call AirPlay.

But the biggest change isn't the dramatically shrinking size, but the dramatically shrinking price.  Mr. Jobs cheers, "The price of Apple TV was $229... users said they'd like to see it more affordable. So we're gonna lower the price, from $229... to just $99."

The device is currently on pre-order from Apple, and can be found here.  It will ship in four weeks.

Will Apple's new social network and cheaper, smaller set-top box steal the show?  Or will users tune them out?  And will Apple help "the other" TV studios "see the light", as it puts it? That remains to be seen, but Apple clearly has clearly worked hard to try to guarantee their success.



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Meh
By Spivonious on 9/1/2010 3:04:47 PM , Rating: 3
I don't see the appeal. Sure it's small and cheap, but it's very limited. No blu-ray support, locked into iTunes, no HD audio bitstreaming, no extensibility. Paying $1 to watch an episode once doesn't seem very appealing to me.

With today's blu-ray players and TVs coming with Netflix/Youtube/Hulu built-in, the average consumer is not going to benefit from this. The "ethusiast" market for this device already have an HTPC, which offers much greater functionality.

My $500 HTPC plays DVDs, blu-rays, Netflix, Youtube, Hulu, music, photos, live TV, recorded TV, gives me the weather forecast, and this is with no more setup than required of a normal PC.

I don't think the new AppleTV will do any better than the old AppleTV did.




RE: Meh
By MrBlastman on 9/1/2010 3:10:06 PM , Rating: 5
I agree. I have a PC and a Wii, I can watch Netflix through both. I see no point in paying for Apple TV, especially when my PC will output to the TV as well in those rare instances I want to watch something Netflix can't offer.

Oh, and I think Shanghai needs a hailstorm right now...


RE: Meh
By othercents on 9/7/2010 11:15:40 AM , Rating: 2
While I have no problems with the HTPC at my house my wife does. She can't get the TV and the HTPC to work at the same time and thinks it is way to complicated for her. This is why I purchased a Blu-Ray player, but even then we don't use the Blu-Ray, we only use the NetFlix and Pandora applications.

If we were using AppleTV then we would purchase more music on iTunes and be able to create playlists that my wife likes on all 3 of my current iTunes devices. Right now it requires her to use a PC to make the playlists and decide on the songs she likes. Which is why Pandora has worked well, but we can't take it in the car with us.

In reality I won't switch my Blu-Ray over to AppleTV since there is really no major benefit for us. However, I might have purchased one when looking at blu-ray players. Someone that is fully invested in iTunes already (IE. Tons of movies and music) might see the AppleTV as a better benefit.

As we move to streaming videos and online rentals we will see Blu-Ray becoming obsolete. This is because a $1 rental is much more appealing than a $10 purchase for a movie you might not like. The size of the AppleTV might be really useful especially if you are mounting the TV on a wall and have the AppleTV mounted behind the TV. Power and networking and you are all set.

Other


RE: Meh
By quiksilvr on 9/1/2010 3:18:52 PM , Rating: 4
Hell, I'll say what needs to be said: This thing is overpriced. It doesn't have a HDD, it doesn't have a USB or SD slot for expansion, it doesn't even have a blu ray drive on it. What makes this device $99? It should be $49, if that.

For $99-$149, I can get actual 1080p functionality, YouTube, Netflix what have you AND the ability to watch Blu ray movies.


RE: Meh
By quiksilvr on 9/1/2010 3:21:30 PM , Rating: 4
And just another point: If this thing had like 8GB onboard and the ability to run Apps, or better yet, being able to act as a bridge to your iPod, iPad, iTouch, Android, RIM, WinMo device so you can actually have the interface on the big screen, that would be a SERIOUS competitor to Google TV.

Hell, have that ability for your computer or laptop as well. No more plugging in wires. Just have 802.11n and there you go.

This thing (just like most Apple products) are under-featured and overpriced.


RE: Meh
By Da W on 9/1/2010 3:25:04 PM , Rating: 1
You have it wrong. Now i'm not saying that the apple model will be the way to go, it might be google, it might be microsoft, it might be cable companies eventually snatching back the technology, but down the road internet TV pay-per-view model at cheap price with no advertising is the future for this business.

You can already stream movies at 1080p, what advantage will the blue ray have? Blue ray is only a transition technology that will not even last as long as a DVD.

Plus, good old grandma and grandpa won't pay 500$ for a HTPC, but a 99$ little black box with a single connector to plug that works out of the box? I'm seeing widespread adoption coming...

You may have subscription model coming eventually, with virtual TV stations, you pay per month and watch the show you want when you want it within that selection. Zune-Napster,Rhapsody already have something similar for music. You will soon ditch your old-big,slow,ugly set-top box and tell your cable company they can ****** it!


RE: Meh
By Spivonious on 9/1/2010 3:48:02 PM , Rating: 2
You cannot stream blu-rays over conventional broadband connections. The video alone averages 30Mbps, with audio adding on another 8-10Mbps.

1920x1080 resolution != blu-ray


RE: Meh
By Suntan on 9/1/2010 4:24:24 PM , Rating: 2
I think you’re overstating things a little. Most BRs I’ve scanned seem to average about 16 to 18Mbps. Further, most BRs have TrueHD or DTSHDMA tracks that tend to run around 4.1Mbps for lossless audio.

Few BRs have fully uncompressed multi-channel PCM audio tracks and few of those run with video bitrates at the max.

To say those are averages is incorrect. More accurate is to say that those are extreme worst cases.

That said, yes, very few ISPs offer pipes fat enough to stream an “average” BR.

-Suntan


RE: Meh
By corduroygt on 9/1/2010 5:21:55 PM , Rating: 2
I'd say the video average is closer to 20-25, 16-18 is the low end. You're right about audio.


RE: Meh
By SunTzu on 9/1/2010 6:55:53 PM , Rating: 2
Are you serious? Where i live, in Sweden, i get 100/10 (or 100/whatever i want up to 100, depending on cost) fairly cheaply, over my cable. No fibre needed at all, and pretty much every apartment in any 20k people+ city has either fiber or cable. I knew US connections sucked, but if you live in a city surely you must be able to get a 100/100 fibre cheaply?


RE: Meh
By corduroygt on 9/1/2010 7:01:37 PM , Rating: 2
Compare the sizes of US and Sweden on a map and then decide for yourself. The best I could ever get would be 50Mbit at a whopping $139 from Fios. I make do with 15.


RE: Meh
By Suntan on 9/1/2010 9:51:50 PM , Rating: 2
Not to mention finding a content provider in Sweden that has licensing agreements to stream any content worth watching...

-Suntan


RE: Meh
By probedb on 9/2/2010 3:34:04 AM , Rating: 2
You're lucky, you'll find most countries don't give you that. Most people here in the UK are lucky if they can get 2/0.5Mbps ADSL!


RE: Meh
By Da W on 9/2/2010 8:55:48 AM , Rating: 4
Ok, let me explain something.
1)Those who post on daily tech = Geeks (me included). And most are apple haters. WE ARE NOT REPRESENTATIVE OF THE AVERAGE CONSUMER.
2)Apple DOES NOT targets geeks. Apple targets my girlfriend who always goes through our rich inventory of french-canadian swearing words the very moment she turns on my windows 7 PC.
3)I'm talking about the FUTURE. 10 years ago we all had crappy phone line internet connections that made crasy noise when we connected. That's only 10 years! Our cell phones are better than that now by a long shot. So don't bring me the argument that you can't stream blue-ray quality over the internet NOW, think in 2 years, 4 years, 6 years.
4)My HD tv cable only outputs at 1080i or 720p, i prefer 720p, it is good enough, and i don't give a rats ass about blue ray. And, as i said, i AM a geek.
5)For that mather would you call the Droid X a piece of crap because it does not output in 1080p?

Bottom line: Blue ray won't be the tsunamy that DVD was, and it will soon be replaced by cheap over the air internent HD streaming.
I rest my case.


RE: Meh
By hexxthalion on 9/2/2010 9:16:33 AM , Rating: 2
:) one of the best comments I've seen on DT


RE: Meh
By Hydrofirex on 9/2/2010 10:58:30 AM , Rating: 2
I completely disagree with your "bottom line". Optical formats will not go away. They are already planning for even higher resolutions beyond 1080P which streaming won't catch up with for some time. There are many factors of course, but a nice uncompressed Blue Ray looks significantly better than anything I've ever streamed online. There will also always be enthusiasts (both computer, video, and audio) who will want the absolute highest fidelity. There are more of them than you might think. While I agree that the technology will hit the 'good enough' point shortly for the masses it will still exist in a thriving ecosystem of content purchase and delivery.

Besides, there will always be a market for a physical product. People like to collect and display their media libraries.

HfX


RE: Meh
By MDGeek on 9/2/10, Rating: -1
RE: Meh
By Spivonious on 9/2/2010 2:40:08 PM , Rating: 3
1. True.

2. True.

3. 10 years ago I had a T3 connection at college. Downloading files was like copying them between hard drives. We got a 6Mbps cable connection at home one year later.

4. Just because you can't see the difference doesn't mean 720p is good enough. Do you play your games at 800x600 too? It's good enough.

5. There is no reason for a phone to output 1080p. Something that is designed to be connected to a TV (i.e. AppleTV) should.

Blu-rays versus DVDs is like DVD Audio versus CD. Not revolutionary, but definitely better when capable equipment is used. I can easily see the difference between a DVD and a Blu-ray, but I have a very nice TV and surround sound setup. I had trouble seeing the difference on my 32" TV with sub-par sound system.

Will Internet streaming take over? Perhaps, but not until the average household has a 50-100Mbps connection.


RE: Meh
By Spivonious on 9/1/2010 3:58:18 PM , Rating: 2
Oh, and I haven't had a cablebox for years.

Grandma could spend $50 more for a blu-ray player that has Netflix built-in. This new AppleTV is horribly overpriced for only offering 720p and very limited source options. Spend another $100 and get a PopcornHour that can play everything you throw at it at 1080p.


RE: Meh
By Reclaimer77 on 9/1/2010 6:26:21 PM , Rating: 2
PoprcornHour's are cool. I checked them out a while back. As an owner can you answer me something plz? What would you say the PopcornHour offers over the Xbox 360 in the way of media extension abilities? Both support the same things as far as I can tell and there's no real price difference once you finish buying all the accessories PopcornHour requires to make it fully functional.


RE: Meh
By cmdrdredd on 9/1/2010 4:03:31 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
You can already stream movies at 1080p, what advantage will the blue ray have? Blue ray is only a transition technology that will not even last as long as a DVD.


30Mbps 1080p bitrate with 10Mbps lossless audio cannot be done on today's internet connections and damn sure not wirelessly. Also, don't forget Blu-Ray is now 3D. This thing can't even do that! you need TWO simultaneous 1080p streams plus the bandwidth for audio to do 3D Blu-Ray quality stuff. Lets see that's 30Mbps x2 and 10Mbps for audio...who's home can do 70Mbps with no signal loss? Sure I have gigabit but does your example of "good old grandma and grandpa"? I'm leaning toward a very big no. Before you say "well, 70Mbps is less than 100Mbps and every network today is probably 100-Base-T". Let me explain something. There's this thing called overhead and if you can show me any standard home PC with standard stuff running, from your average "grandma" that can actually achieve 70Mbps transfers sustained with no loss then I have a cookie for you because the reality is it's not going to be like that. I've streamed Blu-Ray quality video over 100Mbps networks and it sucks to say the least. Your internet connection is many, many, many times slower than 100-base-t ethernet.


RE: Meh
By Suntan on 9/1/2010 4:19:58 PM , Rating: 3
Calm down skippy.

First off, in the real world, traditional 100 Mbps can easily accommodate a BR stream, even two in a lot of cases. If yours couldn’t, you didn’t have it working properly. Further, if you think you are the only person on the planet that has set up a home network and used it to shuttle media around, you’re not. We too all know the limitations of home networks and internet streaming.

Second, not everyone on the planet needs BR quality. The fact remains that “better than DVD” quality is possible over many internet connections. Nobody that actually streams video over the internet today expects to get “BR quality” any time soon. However, a lot of people currently enjoy the convenience of internet streaming and its popularity will only continue to grow. To say that internet streaming is useless because it is not as good as a BR is just silly. To claim otherwise is to be out of touch with reality.

Long story short, does the quality of streaming match BR? Of course not. Is there still a healthy market with large growth potential for video streaming? Of course there is.

-Suntan


RE: Meh
By nafhan on 9/1/2010 5:14:09 PM , Rating: 2
I don't think the parent poster had an issue with the business model or type of device, I think the problem was the details: specifically the device itself and iTunes pricing.
-If you watch more than 1 TV show or movie a day, cable or Hulu+ would be cheaper ) than iTunes for current stuff (although there is commercials.
-The iTV itself doesn't do anything that cheaper/more capable devices don't already do, except for iTunes, which as mentioned above is expensive.


RE: Meh
By Reclaimer77 on 9/1/2010 6:17:48 PM , Rating: 1
quote:
You can already stream movies at 1080p, what advantage will the blue ray have?


From who? Netflix announced they wouldn't be streaming 1080p in 2010. And sure, you could stream 1080p with high compression, but can you also stream the full uncompressed audio like Blu-Ray comes with?

I'm certainly no Blu-Ray fan, but comparing it to steaming HD is just crazy. It's not even close to the same experience.

quote:
but a 99$ little black box with a single connector to plug that works out of the box? I'm seeing widespread adoption coming...


Where you have to individually purchase each thing you watch? I'm seeing another Apple TV FLOP coming.


RE: Meh
By raumkrieger on 9/1/10, Rating: -1
RE: Meh
By Suntan on 9/1/2010 4:30:55 PM , Rating: 3
quote:
My prediction is that this will be the same way. Despite the flaws people will still be fighting over themselves to give Jobs more money.


Really? I think it will be as lack luster as the last AppleTV.

I mean, how much TV does the average Apple-whore really watch? I thought they just sat at coffee houses and watched other people watch them using their Apple products...

-Suntan


RE: Meh
By corduroygt on 9/1/2010 6:25:22 PM , Rating: 2
Precisely! Apple products that you cannot show to other people don't sell well. Think about it, the biggest Apple sellers are the iphone, ipod, and macbook/macbook pros.


RE: Meh
By Drag0nFire on 9/1/2010 4:40:44 PM , Rating: 2
Meh, might be useful once someone hacks it and installs linux...


RE: Meh
By ekv on 9/1/2010 6:42:52 PM , Rating: 2
Lol

better yet, what about hacking Froyo 2.2 onto it ... stable w/ more functionality? D'oh


By TacticalTrading on 9/1/2010 3:10:55 PM , Rating: 4
99 cents for a TV show, that with a hint of forethought I could have recorded on my DVR, or if prime time, can watch from myshowsnetwork dot com, for free (Yes, some commercial interruptions.)
And no 1080p ...
Then again, DirecTV 1080p Movies are like $5.99.
Netflix is great, especially if you have a PS3

But I am confident Jobs has made it easier to use ... for $0.99 per use...

No Thanks




By Suntan on 9/1/2010 4:03:37 PM , Rating: 2
Actually, $.99 per episode is pretty competitive. Look at the pricing per episode over at Amazon VOD. Most of those are $1.99. Admittedly you will probably have more freedom with the Amazon licensing but if you only intent to watch once and then move on it is less important.

I’m as anti-apple as the next guy (...that isn’t covered in wool) but if a person wanted a player to purchase/rent video online with minimal hassle, this thing does compete favorably with the Roku streamers available. The purchase price is higher, but the per episode price is lower (although most movies on Amazon VOD are lower than the Apple ones.)

As a stand alone device, it isn’t *that* out of place. However, it does struggle to justify its worth if a person already has a BR player or some such that offers Netflix streaming, etc.

-Suntan


By nafhan on 9/1/2010 5:23:34 PM , Rating: 3
Competitive and reasonable aren't exactly the same. Watching one 30 min. show an evening would be $30 a month. Makes Hulu+ look like quite a bargain.
I see iTV mainly selling to people who would otherwise not even know about this class of device, and don't shop around because the $100 price is low enough to make it almost an impulse buy.


By Suntan on 9/1/2010 10:07:35 PM , Rating: 2
I think a person would be a little silly to rely on a la cart tv purchases for daily TV watching.

I see a la cart tv downloads as similar to bottled water. You're wasting money if you're filling the pantry next to the faucet with crates of bottles, but when you're out and about the convenience of buying a nice cold bottle of water is worth the price.

Same for a la carte tv episodes. Buying daily shows is wasteful as there are cheaper options for getting them (wait for them to come out on disc at Netflix for example) but if the wife missed an episode of her show, buying one episode so she can catch up is easy money.

-Suntan


By nafhan on 9/2/2010 10:53:45 AM , Rating: 2
I agree. However, that's one of the main selling points of the iTV, and if you don't use it much why even buy the device?
Also, $5 is reasonable for new releases, but not something that's been out for 10 years. Cheap back catalog movies would actually be a good reason to buy this thing.


Found Where?
By PCR on 9/1/2010 3:18:33 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
The device is currently on pre-order from Apple, and can be found here


Where??




RE: Found Where?
By chagrinnin on 9/1/2010 3:56:35 PM , Rating: 2
There!! -------------->

JK,... maybe the link wasn't up when you read the article,...or you're really new to this and didn't know clicking on the word "here" when it's underlined takes you to the "where".

Either way: http://www.apple.com/appletv/


RE: Found Where?
By PCR on 9/1/2010 3:58:23 PM , Rating: 2
LOL!

The link was definitely not there when I posted.


Why?
By Belard on 9/1/2010 7:19:54 PM , Rating: 2
Why don't we get some cool uber-futuristic glass entrance to a computer store/apple store in the USA?

Does it rotate? That would be cool... make it like a spiral feeder to get in or out. You know, like a meat grinder.... the customer stands there why it brings them in.




RE: Why?
By gcor on 9/2/2010 6:41:10 AM , Rating: 2
LOL!

I love the meat grinder idea. Add some secret Apple spices and make burgers out of the legions of Apple fans.

What could they do with all that meat? I wonder if the double arched garbage dispensers would get into the Soylent Green?


Mr. Jobs
By RugMuch on 9/1/2010 3:13:56 PM , Rating: 2
Way to go Mr. Jobs your ideas as incomplete as your apple.




I´ll say it first then
By jvillaro on 9/1/2010 3:23:55 PM , Rating: 2
Ping??? not even iPing... Please somebody start camplaining about this and making fun out of it like yo have about Bing and others...

And just so we´re clear... they say the service looks like facebook or twitter but it´s more of a Zune´s social ripoff. Social, music discovery, status updates con your music client? Everybody made me think Microsoft was the only copy cat...




By azcoyote on 9/1/2010 4:07:20 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Apple clearly has clearly worked hard


Wow... that must REALLY be clear then...




Holy crap!
By RivuxGamma on 9/1/2010 4:23:26 PM , Rating: 2
That spherical building in the back left is way more impressive than that giant public shower.

Also, network guys, be prepared to fight Steve Jobs on use of the word "ping."




Apple's locations in Paris
By UNHchabo on 9/1/2010 5:02:34 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Among the high-profile places where Apple has planted its seed are Paris, France (housed in a restored building)


There are two Apple Store locations in Paris; one is in the Louvre, and the other is in the Paris Opera House. Whichever building you meant, I wouldn't call it merely "a restored building". The two stores are both in buildings that any tourist in Paris will visit.




Apple TV into my PC
By Uchimoriya on 9/2/2010 5:03:23 AM , Rating: 2
Hey I think this Apple TV box can fit nicely inside my rig.
or maybe I can arrange it to fit into my 5 inch bay. :-)

Why would I do such a thing? Because I can! LOL




Apple TV
By williamsck1 on 9/2/2010 2:45:28 PM , Rating: 2
There is already a device that does what Steve says.....and it has more options and been tested for a while now and works great. Plus a ton more channels. Its the Roku box. Sorry, Apple TV does nothing more then the Roku and even removes some.




Netflix & Hulu
By ianday on 9/8/2010 10:30:31 PM , Rating: 2
I don't think the rest of the world cares about the U.S. only services Netflix & Hulu.




Renting TV shows?
By MrTeal on 9/1/2010 3:07:54 PM , Rating: 1
Seriously? A buck to rent a TV show? I can see the benefit of a digital rental of a movie, since you'd have to pay to see it if you went to Blockbuster to get a physical copy of it. But for a new episode of a TV, just set a DVR to record it.

Now, for $100 it's not awful, but it doesn't do much. You'd be better off buying an XBox and get 10x the functionality for twice the money.




that's what i call an update
By hexxthalion on 9/2/10, Rating: 0
By hexxthalion on 9/2/2010 5:49:04 AM , Rating: 1
WD TV Live - that's the one I forgot about :) yes, still better offering. Frankly I've had high hopes for Apple TV, but it looks that I'll get older Mac Mini instead, PLEX on it and hook it to my network with NAS


nitpicking typos and such
By fic2 on 9/1/10, Rating: 0
"If a man really wants to make a million dollars, the best way would be to start his own religion." -- Scientology founder L. Ron. Hubbard














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