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Print 67 comment(s) - last by Cakemeister.. on Jun 13 at 11:18 AM

Leaker walked away from a $200,000 USD salary and "paradise" job in Hawaii to "do the right thing"

Imagine your employer asked you to do something shocking; something you felt threatened the public.  Now imagine that you tried to question the program to your friends, your supervisors, only to see your concerns fall on deaf ears.  Now imagine the reward if you kept quiet -- a comfortable life via a six-figure salary from your employer.

I. Edward Snowden -- The Leaker Behind the NSA Spying Revelations

That's the dilemma that faced Edward Snowden, a 29-year-old information specialist.  For several years, Mr. Snowden worked as a technical specialist at thee U.S. National Security Agency (NSA).  After leaving the NSA, he spent the last four years at various NSA contractors including Dell, Inc. (DELL) and Booz Allen Hamilton (Holding Corp. (BAH)).  During his time at these employers, he was ordered to work on various programs that repurposed the NSA -- originally an agency purposed with spying on foreign communications -- into an agency that spied on American citizens, sometimes on a massive scale.

Mr. Snowden saw how these efforts could be turned on innocent Americans and it sickened him.  So he decided to blow the whistle.  

But unlike some other leakers -- like accused leaker and former Army private Bradley Manning -- he put in the effort to leak his privileged information to a source he knew would handle it responsibly.  Mr. Manning gave up after initially receiving no response from a handful of news agencies (including The Washington Post), and hence turned to the less scrupulous Wikileaks. By contrast Mr. Snowden also took a while to develop contacts at Britain's Guardian and The Washington Post, but he persisted until he achieve the means to blow the whistle responsibly, much like Daniel Ellsberg did in 1969 with the leak of the Pentagon Papers.


Mr. Snowden leaked information on two major programs to the two publications.  First he revealed an unnamed order by the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court (FISA) to allow the NSA to indiscriminately seize "metadata", including location-tracking data, from America's largest carrier, Verizon Communications Inc. (VZ) and Vodafone Group Plc.'s (LON:VOD) Verizon Wireless.  That seizure provided information that could be used to track on a "daily basis" the location of over a third of Americans who had never committed a crime.

The second leak revealed a more specific, but more aggressive effort dubbed "PRISM", which allowed the NSA to seize internet records from firms like Google, Inc. (GOOG), Apple, Inc. (AAPL), and Microsoft Corp. (MSFT) under FISA gag order.  These record grabs revealed much more information, including private communication logs, but ostensibly were only to be used against individuals suspected of committing crimes such as the funding of or participation in terrorism.

After leaking details of the programs, Mr. Snowden came forward, insisting on outing himself and refusing to hide in the shadows.

The young technical wizard turned leaker insists he's no hero for revealing details of these programs.  He comments:

I don't see myself as a hero, because what I'm doing is self-interested. I don't want to live in a world where there's no privacy, and therefore no room for intellectual exploration and creativity.  I'm willing to sacrifice [my income and career success] because I can't in good conscience allow the U.S. government to destroy privacy, Internet freedom and basic liberties for people around the world with this massive surveillance machine they're secretly building.

The whistleblower is currently giving interviews in Hong Kong, China, awaiting the inevitable response from the U.S. government.

II. Mr. Snowden Called a "Defector", Faces Pending Charges

The response from the U.S. looks to be fast coming. Mr. Snowden faces serious repercussions for blowing the whistle on the U.S. government, who under President Barack Obama's (D) leadership has been ruthless in hounding the press in the hunt for leakers.

Eager to silence future would-be leakers, the Obama administration is looking to push harsh punishments for Mr. Snowden as is receiving support from some Republicans in Congress.

Program supporters are defending both PRISM and the broader phone records grab.  They say the information helped them capture Najibullah Zazi (Colo.), who in Sept. 2009 plotted to bomb New York City's subway system.  They also say they helped track David Headley, an American who participated in the Mumbai, India terrorist attacks of 2009, according to Sen. Dianne Feinstein (D-Calif.).

 
While the U.S. did not act on other information it obtained without Orwellian surveillance -- such as the information from Russian intelligence that the Boston bombing suspects were working with terrorists -- Sen. Feinstein and others insist the surveillance of Americans (both warrantless and with warrant) is necessary -- regardless of what the Constitution says -- to catch criminals or fight "terror".

U.S. Rep. Peter T. King (R-New York) called Mr. Snowden a "defector", remarking: This person is dangerous to the country.  If Edward Snowden did in fact leak the NSA data as he claims, the United States government must prosecute him to the fullest extent of the law and begin extradition proceedings at the earliest date.  The United States must make it clear that no country should be granting this individual asylum. This is a matter of extraordinary consequence to American intelligence.

Rep. King is known as a supporter of "big government", enthusiastically endorsing both the Wall Street bailout and the Oct. 2001 USA PATRIOT (Uniting and Strengthening America by Providing Appropriate Tools Required to Intercept and Obstruct Terrorism) Act which allows the warrantless surveillance of Americans.

Now he and his like-minded Republican and Democrat colleagues are pushing to extradite Mr. Snowden.

III. Leaker Fears for His Family, Girlfriend

Mr. Snowden is reportedly living in hotels off of credit cards.  He is fearful that the U.S. government may either seek to kill him, seek to extradite him, or seek to capture him in a covert operation.  Alternatively, he fears the Chinese government could capture and torture him looking to extract secrets from his time at the NSA.  

Edward Snowden
Edward Snowden, NSA whistleblower [Image Source: Reuters]

He comments:

All my options are bad. 

Yes, I could be rendered by the CIA. I could have people come after me. Or any of the third-party partners. They work closely with a number of other nations. Or they could pay off the Triads. Any of their agents or assets.

We have got a CIA station just up the road – the consulate here in Hong Kong – and I am sure they are going to be busy for the next week. And that is a concern I will live with for the rest of my life, however long that happens to be.

Mr. Snowden is considering fleeing to Iceland, which is known for offering leniency to leakers.  But getting asylum from Iceland may be trick as he would have to get there -- Kristin Arnadottir, Iceland's ambassador to China, explains that asylum requests require an individual to be in her country.

And he is perhaps most afraid that the U.S. government will look to harass and punish his family members or girlfriend (who lives in Hawaii), as that has been a popular technique used by other totalitarian nationalist regimes in the past.

He remarks, "I do not expect to see home again, though that is what I want."

IV. The Formation of a Whistleblower

The dramatic outing culminates what was a strange and secretive journey for Mr. Snowden.  Originally a struggling high school student with a talent at hacking, he enlisted in the Army in 2003, training to be part of a Special Forces unit.  He recalls the training being disillusioning to his young idealism, commenting to Guardian, "I wanted to fight in the Iraq war because I felt like I had an obligation as a human being to help free people from oppression.  Most of the people training us seemed pumped up about killing Arabs, not helping anyone."

He broke both of his legs during a training exercise and received a discharge.  From there he decided to try to stick it out with the government employment route, becoming a security guard at a secret NSA facility at the University of Maryland.  But his talent with computers soon drove him into information technology positions, despite his lack of formal education.

In 2007 he went to work for the U.S. Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) and was stationed as an IT security specialist in Geneva, Switzerland.  His time at the CIA, during which he had access to seas of classified documents and program details, he cites as being responsible for solidifying his opinion that the U.S. government was losing sight of its ideals.

CIA HQ
Mr. Snowden worked for the CIA for a couple of years. [Image Source: AP Photo]

He recalls an alleged incident in which U.S. agents were rebuffed by a Swiss banker, and thus turned to entrapping him, encouraging him to get drunk and drive home.  When the banker was arrested for drunk driving, they used that as leverage to extract the information they wanted.  He comments, "Much of what I saw in Geneva really disillusioned me about how my government functions and what its impact is in the world.  I realized that I was part of something that was doing far more harm than good."

Still, Mr. Snowden's decision to leak was not yet made up.  He left the CIA in 2009 and went to work for a private contractor at an NSA facility in Japan.  Like many he was optimistic when President Obama took office in 2008 preaching a message of "hope" and "change".

He thought perhaps Obama would end the spying programs, which he felt represented "an existential threat to democracy."

But that was not the case.  He recalls, "[I] watched as Obama advanced the very policies that I thought would be reined in.  I got hardened."

The disappointing outcome with President Obama taught him a valuable lesson -- "You can't wait around for someone else to act. I had been looking for leaders, but I realised that leadership is about being the first to act."

So last year, after much deliberation he walked away from a $200,000 USD salary at an NSA contractor in Hawaii, and a comfortable life with his girlfriend.  Now he's confident to face his destiny, though he is understandably afraid for his family's safety as well as his own.

V. President Obama Defends Spying Program, Some Details Get Declassified

In the wake of the leaks the Director of Nation Intelligence (DNI) has released a statement condemning the leak and has declassified some details of PRISM, and is claiming no Americans were spied upon in the program.  Disclosed last Thursday by The Washington Post and Guardian it was clear that the program was used to spy only on a limited, finite number of individuals, however it remained unclear whether any of those individuals were citizens of the United States.

Obama
U.S. President Barack Obama (D) defended the spying program. [Image Source: AP]

President Obama himself addressed the concerns, commenting in an interview:

Nobody is listening to your phone calls.... [The] court authorizes the initial gathering of data, but I want to repeat, if anybody in government wanted to go further than just that top-line data [e.g. location of citizens] and wanted to, for example, listen to Jackie Calmes’s phone call, they’d have to go back to a federal judge and — and — and indicate why, in fact, they were doing further — further probing.

Internet monitoring is only for those outside United States; we have to balance keeping America safe with privacy concerns.

And in a statement by the DNI Director James Clapper entitled "Facts on Collection of Information Pursuant to Section 702" his office writes:

It is an internal government computer system used to facilitate the government's statutorily authorized collection of foreign intelligence information from electronic communication service providers under court supervision...This authority was created by the Congress and has been widely known and publicly discussed since its inception in 2008.

In short, Section 702 facilitates the targeted acquisition of foreign intelligence information concerning foreign targets located outside the United States under court oversight. Service providers supply information to the Government when they are lawfully required to do so.

According to the U.S. government, PRISM's efforts were not targeted at Americans and while eye-opening, were much more limited than the unnamed "metadata" court grabs under FISA court order (or other more sweeping state surveillance programs by the Bush and Obama administrations).

VI. Supporters of Snowden Rally

Amidst the efforts to charge and extradite Mr. Snowden he is receiving some support.

Daniel Ellsberg, the Pentagon Papers leaker, comments to CNN:

I think he's done an enormous service.  It gives us a chance, I think, from drawing back from the total surveillance state that we could say we're in process of becoming, I'm afraid we have become.

Rep. Ron Paul (R-Texas), labeled by many experts as a prominent opponent of big oppressive government and defender of the Constitution, comments:


The reaction of some in Congress and the Administration to last week’s leak was predictable. Knee-jerk defenders of the police state such as Senator Lindsey Graham declared that he was “glad” the government was collecting Verizon phone records—including his own—because the government needs to know what the enemy is up to. Those who take an oath to defend the Constitution from its enemies both foreign and domestic should worry about such statements.

House Intelligence Committee Chairman Mike Rogers tells us of the tremendous benefits of this Big Brother-like program. He promises us that domestic terrorism plots were thwarted, but he cannot tell us about them because they are classified. I am a bit skeptical, however. In April, the New York Times reported that most of these domestic plots were actually elaborate sting operations developed and pushed by the FBI. According to the Times report, “of the 22 most frightening plans for attacks since 9/11 on American soil, 14 were developed in sting operations.”

The government does not need to know more about what we are doing. We need to know more about what the government is doing. We need to turn the cameras on the police and on the government, not the other way around. We should be thankful for writers like Glenn Greenwald, who broke last week’s story, for taking risks to let us know what the government is doing. There are calls for the persecution of Greenwald and the other whistle-blowers and reporters. They should be defended, as their work defends our freedom.

Other civil liberty organizations also released statements of supports for the young leaker and his decision to disclose to a responsible source.

Sources: Guardian UK [1], [2], WSJ Wire [Obama remarks], DNI



Comments     Threshold


This article is over a month old, voting and posting comments is disabled

This story doesn't add up.
By BRB29 on 6/10/13, Rating: 0
RE: This story doesn't add up.
By nafhan on 6/10/2013 2:20:04 PM , Rating: 5
Although that information would be interesting, I kind of feel like his motives are more or less a footnote here. The important thing is that some of what he said has been confirmed - and it's terrible.

Also worth noting: it sounds like he expects bad things to happen to him. So, it's likely he's not unaware of the flaws in his plans. Further, I doubt that illegally accessing some systems on top of everything else will notably worsen his legal position (IMO).


RE: This story doesn't add up.
By BRB29 on 6/10/13, Rating: -1
RE: This story doesn't add up.
By nafhan on 6/10/2013 4:36:43 PM , Rating: 2
"Can" and "can do so (essentially) extra-judiciously" are two very different things. Further, I think confirmation that major ISP's and service providers are directly participating in this is actually a pretty big deal.

I do agree that there's almost certainly more to the guys story. Not arguing there. I just feel like that's the less important aspect of the story.


RE: This story doesn't add up.
By BRB29 on 6/10/2013 8:43:13 PM , Rating: 2
This is not anything new. Telecoms have already been compliant to these types of orders for decades. Mobile sector is new because well...it is new lol compared to land lines.

The story is lacking. If you think the missing info is the less important aspect of the story.....then i don't know what the hell you're thinking lol. The missing part is probably bigger since that is why it is missing. If this guy is really running away with real info, this is nothing more than a distraction.

Let me give you some facts I see missing.

1. Why doesn't he have a National Defense Medal? That's fishy since supposedly he qualified for it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Defense_Serv...
The requirement is 90 days of active service. Training is always considered active service. His story is he broke both legs and was discharged. Army says no medal, no training complete. At the very least, he should've completed basic in that time. I'm guessing he never made it past basic. No branch currently or ever guarantee an MOS for special forces. They only let you try out. You cannot try out unless you at least finish basic training(boot camp).

2. He had no education besides a GED. Never completed anything in the army.

3. NSA hired him as a security guard. I find that odd that they would hire him when he was discharged for 2 broken legs supposedly. I know when I applied to do security, I was medically declined. They can still hire him if he proves to be fit for duty. That's a hard contradiction to being discharged because he was found UNFIT for duty due to his broken legs.

4. He was then hired as an IT specialist without any education or certification. Usually they require at least a bachelor or a lot of experience and certifications. Either the government was desperate or something is misssing here. If you doubt what I say then go to usajobs and look up IT announcements for IT information security specialists positions.

5. He worked for 3 years in the NSA and moved to work as a contractor. This is weird as everyone I know wants the federal position instead of the contractor positions. Federal positions pay competitively, better benefits, guaranteed employment, and never a pay decrease(except furloughs). I also doubt that he gets paid 200k a year. With his years of experience and lack of education, he should be 100k-125k mainly for his security clearance. With a Masters, he would be making 150k+

I could go on about the shady details but there's more than enough for everybody to think about. His story sounds fake at first glance and still is.


RE: This story doesn't add up.
By nafhan on 6/10/2013 10:19:41 PM , Rating: 2
Again, I agree there's probably more to the story.

Whether or not his story "sounds fake" (do you mean unlikely?), there's still the little factoid that US intelligence agencies and the President are agreeing with details of the released info. At the very least, that's extremely interesting and unusual given the content. Since I guess I wasn't very clear: the guys life story is the less interesting thing here , and the released info and it's validation by the US gov. is the interesting part . (lol?).

Also agree that it could be nothing more than a distraction (which begs the question: distraction from what? Now THAT would be something crazy). If additional details and info do come to light, I may change my mind regarding what the more interesting aspect of this story is. Although long disregarded online, changing ones opinion is acceptable in some circles!

Additionally, regarding your #1: I worked with someone pre-accepted into the PJ's - there was of course a provision that he pass through all the training (reserve unit, so requirements may be a little different). The never finishing basic seems to fit, though. #3: some jobs are less strenuous than special forces. Specifically, I've seen the elderly work as "security guards". #2 and #4: experience and connections go a LONG way - especially with contractors. That said: #5 Agreed, very odd. Although, if they really were paying 200k, there's your reason for moving away from a "safe" gov. job where he was getting 100-125k.


RE: This story doesn't add up.
By BRB29 on 6/10/2013 10:47:15 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
regarding your #1: I worked with someone pre-accepted into the PJ's - there was of course a provision that he pass through all the training (reserve unit, so requirements may be a little different). The never finishing basic seems to fit, though

I actually know how it works because I was in it. Regardless whether you are reserve or active, you are going through the same basic and MOS school. It's not different, it's the exact same way. The only difference being the active duty guy stays active and join a regular unit while the reserve guy joins a reserve unit. Up until they receive those orders, they are both active duty in training.
On top of that, army basic is 9 weeks long. He was well past that and didn't finish the training.
quote:
3: some jobs are less strenuous than special forces. Specifically, I've seen the elderly work as "security guards".

Yes, but if he got out because he broke his legs then he would be collecting disabilities. Usually, when I see people get discharged for medical reasons they are on Temporary Disability Retirement List unless you are obviously missing limbs then you are permanent immediately. If you are on TDRL, and you took a job that says you are fit for duty that contradict your disability then you have major problems. You either get sent back to the military, lose your benefits, or just don't get the job because you're lying.

quote:
experience and connections go a LONG way - especially with contractors. That said

Yes it does IF you qualify. Federal employment is also as fair, transparent and objective as they get. Every job has to be publicly announced on usajobs.com. The resume is also scanned by a computer before it spits out the top 5 or whatever most qualified. Then the HR and management do the interviews. While you CAN hook someone up, if someone is more qualified and proves that then you still cannot beat them.

There's very rare chance he's paying them 200k. Just look at their websites. These contractors usually post a salary range because they are contractors and they get paid a fixed amount. It's either project by size or cost + % usually. That is why you cannot hook someone up with an overinflated salary since you are in a bidding for contract. The lowest bidder wins. Overpaying employees don't win contracts. On the other hand, there is pretty much a standard pay scale for contractors. Sure you usually get paid more than federal employees but you are not guaranteed a job. Many of my friends that are contractors sometimes go 6 months to a year between contracts. It's normal and hence the higher pay. I just don't see how this guy is getting 200k when there are plenty of people much more qualified making less.

Go ask any contractor which they would choose and I'll bet just about every single one of them will choose to be a federal employee. I don't know why anyone wouldn't. You get all the benefits, huge amounts of vacation time and sick leave. You also get a retirement pension and TSP(like 401k) matching up to 5% of income. Did I mention your job is secured? Even if you are involuntarily laid off because of closing of an office, then you are given displaced employee priority for other positions.


RE: This story doesn't add up.
By Lord 666 on 6/10/2013 11:30:46 PM , Rating: 2
Distraction from the pending Immigration legislation or Manning trial would be my guess.

Concur about your theories of the official Snowden story not adding up.


RE: This story doesn't add up.
By BRB29 on 6/11/2013 7:40:55 AM , Rating: 2
What? this is not a distraction from anything. This whole thing was blown up by the media BTW. If anything, you can say the media wants more hits since TV industry is struggling.


RE: This story doesn't add up.
By Reclaimer77 on 6/11/2013 8:38:46 AM , Rating: 2
The lengths you go to be an apologist for this administration is just stunning, get a life.

So let me get this straight, only you, using Google has figured out that this guy's entire life and everything he claims to be and his whole career is a lie. Just you? Nobody else did any research they just ran with the fake story? Yeah that's real believable.

And your claims that the media, which has been extremely pro Obama would go to these lengths is laughable.


RE: This story doesn't add up.
By BRB29 on 6/11/2013 8:42:45 AM , Rating: 2
watch the video in the article and tell me if that politician defending the NSA is rep or dem.


RE: This story doesn't add up.
By BSMonitor on 6/10/13, Rating: -1
RE: This story doesn't add up.
By nafhan on 6/10/2013 4:44:10 PM , Rating: 5
So... Congress knows about it, and that makes it OK? The government does good things and bad things; legal and illegal things. The fact that members of Congress knew about it doesn't make it good or legal.

Whether or not he should be prosecuted is a separate issue. I kind of agree that he should be.
quote:
He doesn't get to decide what is or isn't classified intelligence. That's what Congress is for.
You trust your elected officials a lot more than I think anyone should. We've given them that power (sort of), but that doesn't mean they're always going to be correct. In this case, I think it's very possible they're illegally gathering information on American citizens.


RE: This story doesn't add up.
By BRB29 on 6/10/2013 7:49:00 PM , Rating: 2
Congress doesn't decide what's classified either. By how slow they work, if they have to decide what's should be classified or not then they couldn't even get a tax bill passed every year.


I'll default to the Geekness
By chuckus on 6/10/2013 2:03:42 PM , Rating: 5
This guy is a legitimate geek and, I'm willing to bet, a talented systems engineer. He kinda oozes it.

My point being that I'm going to logically trust his statements on what the capabilities of the intelligence gathering systems he's working on are not only legitimate but that he has an innate understanding of how they function, i.e, actual capabilities.

Meanwhile we're getting a counterpoint from Feinstein and Rogers on what these intelligence gathering technologies "actually" do and how innocuous they are to personal liberties.

How much do you want to bet that neither one of these two politicians even know what version of operating system they log into every day.

They are the experts on the program because they're the intelligence chairs in the house and senate. No, I think that they're pretty much just politicians.




RE: I'll default to the Geekness
By mcnabney on 6/10/13, Rating: 0
I knew it!
By Ammohunt on 6/10/2013 1:53:15 PM , Rating: 2
I have seen this guy before!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Byh5k-m2SqI




RE: I knew it!
By OoklaTheMok on 6/10/2013 4:21:05 PM , Rating: 2
HAHA... awesome!


This guy is not a whistleblower
By Cakemeister on 6/13/2013 11:18:56 AM , Rating: 2
If he was he would have gone to Rep. Paul or some other libertarian. He could have testified to Congress without any leaks, similar to Gregory Hicks vis a vis the Benghazi investigation.

He is a spy, by his own admission. He should be tried for espionage.




LOL!
By Spuke on 6/10/13, Rating: -1
RE: LOL!
By half_duplex on 6/10/2013 1:13:01 PM , Rating: 4
You're forgetting he spent years at the NSA. I think it's safe to say he knows a little more about the trouble he's in than you do. He very well could be in danger.

It's yet to be seen if he broke any law.


RE: LOL!
By BRB29 on 6/10/13, Rating: 0
RE: LOL!
By mritter1981 on 6/11/2013 3:22:31 AM , Rating: 2
He can still be brought up on charges, pertaining to his release of Classified information (even FOUO info is considered classified). He was required to sign a Non-Disclosure Agreement, just to work with the NSA (or any government agency). I can bet that he will at the least be prosecuted on the NDA alone.


RE: LOL!
By BRB29 on 6/11/2013 7:38:24 AM , Rating: 2
so what does that have anything to do with his family?
I'm sure I know how clearances work more than you.


RE: LOL!
By Master Kenobi (blog) on 6/10/2013 1:50:03 PM , Rating: 2
The only danger he is in is jail time for espionage. You guys watch way too many movies. Jason Bourne isn't going to go pick this guy up tomorrow and erase him.


RE: LOL!
By BRB29 on 6/10/2013 1:53:29 PM , Rating: 1
lol what do you think when Jason Mick is writing sensational articles? this is the kind of crap that gets some people paranoid.


RE: LOL!
By Spuke on 6/10/2013 2:51:05 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
The only danger he is in is jail time for espionage. You guys watch way too many movies.
Yet I get downrated for saying the same thing. I stand by my comment.


RE: LOL!
By BRB29 on 6/10/2013 2:53:23 PM , Rating: 2
more than likely, it's someone here with multi accounts. I wouldn't worry about it. I get downrated all the time. Then someone jumps in and say the same thing that gets +4 lol.


RE: LOL!
By Spuke on 6/10/2013 3:13:37 PM , Rating: 2
I'm not worried but thanks anyways.


RE: LOL!
By theapparition on 6/10/2013 2:56:23 PM , Rating: 2
Actually, I don't think he could get charged with espionage. Most likely would get multiple counts of disseminating classified information.


RE: LOL!
By bh192012 on 6/10/2013 3:19:04 PM , Rating: 2
Yeah, stupid fake movies.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Khalid_El-Masri

Later this month when we get news that Edward Snowden has decided to "go into hiding," I won't hold my breath that's what's actually happening. I used to laugh at some of the conspiracy theorists, but lately damn. Our government is getting sketchier every day.


RE: LOL!
By Spuke on 6/10/2013 3:28:51 PM , Rating: 2
If he goes into hiding than that's exactly what has happened. No one has ever been killed for leaking classified stuff and, quite frankly, what he leaked is nothing compared to other breaches of security.


RE: LOL!
By wookie1 on 6/10/2013 1:19:09 PM , Rating: 2
You really think that President Retribution and Punch Back Twice as Hard will just let this slide? He hates nothing more than people that embarass him. The DOJ has vigorously pursued leakers in the past. I think they will do anything to get to him, but the easiest thing would probably just be a drone strike. There are no messy extradition problems with that.


RE: LOL!
By Jeffk464 on 6/10/2013 1:47:44 PM , Rating: 2
Yeah right, a drone strike in Hong Kong. That would be a brilliant move.


RE: LOL!
By wookie1 on 6/10/2013 8:06:01 PM , Rating: 2
They won't say that they wouldn't kill a US citizen on US soil, HK is remote. Anyway I was kind of kidding about that, but I wouldn't be surprised if we don't hear from him again since he's checked out of the HK hotel.


RE: LOL!
By BRB29 on 6/10/2013 8:21:09 PM , Rating: 2
Hong Kong is far from remote my friend.


RE: LOL!
By cyberguyz on 6/10/2013 1:51:27 PM , Rating: 2
Man, what country are you living in?

quote:
This guy has obviously spent too much time watching movies.

Nope. He just lives in a country where this kind of thing is so commonplace. Here's a guy that can actually prove wrong doing in his government and everybody knows what will happen to him (and his family if they dare to say anything about it).

quote:
There have been numerous breaches of security in years past 9with MUCH more damage than what this guys did) with none killed or otherwise violated in any way.


That you know of. Do you really expect these guys are going to actually let everybody know they are making people disappear? If you do, I have some land that I am selling by the bucket.

quote:
He broke the law and he should man up and face the consequences.


What law exactly? There is a law against someone providing evidence of illegal activity? Please point that law out for us please! I would love to see it.

Remember that all government started off as a protection racket (Give me 50% of your crop and we will keep the bad guys from burning your fields!)


RE: LOL!
By BRB29 on 6/10/2013 2:01:54 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Man, what country are you living in?

USA
quote:
Nope. He just lives in a country where this kind of thing is so commonplace. Here's a guy that can actually prove wrong doing in his government and everybody knows what will happen to him (and his family if they dare to say anything about it).

There's actually channels he can go to for reporting government abuse legally and be protected. He could also point this to any politicians that would support his side. They are more than a handful of them that would. They all know about his because they voted on it.
quote:
That you know of. Do you really expect these guys are going to actually let everybody know they are making people disappear? If you do, I have some land that I am selling by the bucket.

Umm...too much movies

quote:
What law exactly? There is a law against someone providing evidence of illegal activity? Please point that law out for us please! I would love to see it.

it is not illegal. It was voted in Congress with 2/3 majority. He could actually bring this through the proper channel or get a Pro-privacy politician to push this up to the Supreme court. Instead he did the dumbest thing, which anybody with knowledge on how these things work will automatically think he had alternative motives.

quote:
Remember that all government started off as a protection racket (Give me 50% of your crop and we will keep the bad guys from burning your fields!

Not even close. You may have watched too many post apocalyptic movies. We have a laws in black and white prints.
If you're talking about the old days then there had always been some type of royalty, lords, etc... that controlled the all of the land. The common folks never owned anything besides what's on their body.


RE: LOL!
By Spuke on 6/10/2013 2:54:07 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Nope. He just lives in a country where this kind of thing is so commonplace.
Name one instance in the US where someone leaked secrets and got him and/or his family killed by the NSA or any other government agency. WOW are some of you CRAZY paranoid.


RE: LOL!
By tamalero on 6/10/2013 3:07:56 PM , Rating: 2
Would torture be in the spotlight?
I would say the living proof is .. that marine who leaked to wikileaks.


RE: LOL!
By Spuke on 6/10/2013 3:11:12 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Would torture be in the spotlight? I would say the living proof is .. that marine who leaked to wikileaks.
And you can't read!! LOL!


RE: LOL!
By Jeffk464 on 6/10/2013 3:42:23 PM , Rating: 2
The pakastani doctor that collected blood from Osama binladin

Oops that was probably a key word like

Car bomb
Ammonia nitrate


RE: LOL!
By Spuke on 6/10/2013 3:56:44 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
The pakastani doctor that collected blood from Osama binladin
Still not reading my post. :sigh:


RE: LOL!
By Lord 666 on 6/10/2013 10:59:12 PM , Rating: 2
Chris Kyle


RE: LOL!
By Lord 666 on 6/10/2013 11:10:01 PM , Rating: 2
Keith Ratliff


typo?
By GulWestfale on 6/10/13, Rating: -1
RE: typo?
By glowingghoul on 6/10/2013 1:41:16 PM , Rating: 2
"starts wars for oil" Proof?

"pumps the lion's share of its tax money into teh military" Wrong, it's 19%, smaller than Social Security or Medicare, each of which are 22% and 21% respectively.

"mister jason "fox news" mick."

And you are Mr. MoveOn/MSNBC/Mother Jones


RE: typo?
By tayb on 6/10/2013 2:37:14 PM , Rating: 2
I wish the wars were for oil. At least then we would have had a real reason to have spent $7,000,000,000,000 overseas and accomplishing absolutely nothing. We've made enemies of dozens of nations and ended the lives of thousands of citizens... for nothing. If the end goal was simply to modernize our military we could have done that for half the cost.

Social security is not a fair example. That money is drawn from your paycheck whether you want it to or not. The government is simply repaying the money they took from you. It's not entitlement. Medicare is similar but has some key differences.


RE: typo?
By BRB29 on 6/10/2013 2:51:39 PM , Rating: 2
I've seen all kinds of estimate from $1 trillion all the way to $4 trillions. I've never seen $7trillion lol. You must have learned this from Jason or nitpicked a source that matches your agenda.


RE: typo?
By BSMonitor on 6/10/2013 3:38:46 PM , Rating: 2
It absolutely was about opening Iraq to Western Oil Companies. But who said those Oil companies have to bring that oil here??


RE: typo?
By tamalero on 6/10/2013 2:59:54 PM , Rating: 2
So, you really believe the war on Iraq was really for Saddam? or "terrorism"?
naive guy.


RE: typo?
By Spuke on 6/10/2013 3:24:36 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
So, you really believe the war on Iraq was really for Saddam? or "terrorism"? naive guy.
Ignorance is bliss. Most of our oil STILL doesn't come from Iraq. Look to the north and south for that. That war was for weapons of mass destruction. When it was discovered that intelligence was completely wrong, it turned to terrorism. Not defending that war at all! Congress should've pulled the plug but they typically don't (they have before though).


RE: typo?
By BSMonitor on 6/10/2013 3:37:00 PM , Rating: 2
Who said it was a war for Americans to get more/cheaper oil?? Exxon Mobil is doing quite well in Iraq.. Who said anything about helping Americans get that oil.

Pre-war Iraq = Closed to Western Oil Companies.

Post-war Iraq = Free for all open market. China, Exxon Mobil, etc etc etc...

Removing Saadam was about opening the oil fields to corporations. The corporations that lobbied Congress to go to war...


RE: typo?
By BRB29 on 6/10/2013 3:46:24 PM , Rating: 1
lol best conspiracy so far.


RE: typo?
By Skywalker123 on 6/11/2013 2:55:10 PM , Rating: 2
Are you really that stupid and naive?


RE: typo?
By Skywalker123 on 6/11/2013 2:51:05 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
That war was for weapons of mass destruction

Are you freakin kidding? The war was fought to destroy Israel's most powerful enemy.


This sums this guys up
By Ammohunt on 6/10/13, Rating: -1
RE: This sums this guys up
By JasonMick (blog) on 6/10/2013 2:10:06 PM , Rating: 5
quote:
This is all i need to know about this guy....should have joined the peace corp dumbass! Millenials bah! they will be the end of us all.
Are you suggesting the it's a bad thing to want to help people and a good thing to be excited about killing people?

He clearly was willing to kill if he was joining the army wit the intention of freeing (note: the implied use of force) "oppressed" people in the Middle East. I doubt he would have moral compunctions with shooting a member of Saddam Hussein's nationalist guard.

His complaint was w.r.t. to the blanket racist sentiments/eagerness to participate in violence without a purpose that he claims to have witnessed. Surely you don't support violent acts that don't serve a higher purpose like bring terrorists to justice or liberating oppressed people? Do you honestly support being excited just to kill a person because of their religion or skin color?


RE: This sums this guys up
By BRB29 on 6/10/2013 2:34:47 PM , Rating: 2
quote:
Originally a struggling high school student with a talent at hacking, he enlisted in the Army in 2003, training to be part of a Special Forces unit


You cannot enlist to join the special forces. Everyone has a possibility to try out for it if they have the qualifications and passed several rigorous tests. Therefore, you must enlist with a regular MOS and try out for the special forces if you can make it.

quote:
Typically, so-called 18X candidates are approved to try out for a position in the army special forces, often after passing a vocational aptitude test, but selection to the elite cadre is never guaranteed. Training is a rigorous physical and mental challenge lasting 14 weeks.


quote:
His complaint was w.r.t. to the blanket racist sentiments/eagerness to participate in violence without a purpose that he claims to have witnessed. Surely you don't support violent acts that don't serve a higher purpose like bring terrorists to justice or liberating oppressed people? Do you honestly support being excited just to kill a person because of their religion or skin color?


Umm...that's the military. People willing to go far usually have a good reason to do so. I feel the same way. I'm ready to go get them. I also have 2 muslim Marines under my charge that none of us ever discriminate. They also shared the same feelings. None of us are eager to shoot a certain group of people. We're all eager to do our mission because that's what we signed up for. The only group you can say we are always eager to take out are terrorists regardless of their skin, religion, ethnicity. Does that make you feel better or are you going to twist more?

but don't let that get in the way of your sensational journalism.


RE: This sums this guys up
By Ammohunt on 6/10/13, Rating: -1
RE: This sums this guys up
By BRB29 on 6/10/2013 2:37:46 PM , Rating: 2
Here is now nutty is guy is.

quote:
Snowden self-identifies as a spook. "I've been a spy almost all of my adult life," he told the Washington Post. In his communications with a reporter, he used a code name — "Verax," or truth-teller in Latin. He's worried he's being watched and puts a red hood over his head and laptop when he enters passwords, The Guardian reported.


http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/06/10/1888261...


RE: This sums this guys up
By tamalero on 6/10/2013 2:59:00 PM , Rating: 4
would you blame him if he knows the power and tools the NSA uses to spy and track people?
some people are happier knowing NOTHING of what really goes on in the world.


RE: This sums this guys up
By Spuke on 6/10/13, Rating: 0
RE: This sums this guys up
By BRB29 on 6/10/2013 3:50:21 PM , Rating: 2
I know the tools and power the NSA, FBI, SS etc... have and also the people. I have absolutely 0 fears except for the occasional nut jobs that always get caught. I'm worried more about crazy politicians(state senators and reps) than actual federal employees.


RE: This sums this guys up
By Skywalker123 on 6/11/2013 2:58:29 PM , Rating: 2
Wasnt J.Edgar Hoover a federal employee?


RE: This sums this guys up
By Dorkyman on 6/10/2013 5:42:50 PM , Rating: 2
Does anybody else note the strong resemblance to White House Spokesman Jay Carney?

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2013/05/14/...

Coincidence? I think not.


RE: This sums this guys up
By amelia321 on 6/10/13, Rating: -1
"I mean, if you wanna break down someone's door, why don't you start with AT&T, for God sakes? They make your amazing phone unusable as a phone!" -- Jon Stewart on Apple and the iPhone














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