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Hardware Acer: No Demand For Linux PCs in U.K.
Michael Hoffman (Blog) - August 1, 2007 6:06 PM

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28 comment(s) - last by PrinceGaz.. on Aug 3 at 11:06 AM

Acer Ubuntu ad (Source: Singapore HardwareZone)

Ubuntu Linux on Acer products look promising in Singapore, but not the U.K., according to Acer

While Dell recently broke into the Linux market by offering several pre-loaded Ubuntu Linux PCs and notebooks, Acer is also testing the pre-loaded Linux waters. A published ad recently surfaced which shows the Acer Aspire 5710Z notebook, currently for sale in Singapore, pre-loaded with a Linux operating system instead of Windows.

Even though the ad shows the product shipping with Ubuntu Linux, it looks like the retailer in Singapore was responsible for removing a different OS before installing Ubuntu on the laptops.

Acer will not ship products with Ubuntu or Linux offerings until demand for the products continues to rise.

An Acer spokesperson confirmed Acer does not have any immediate plans to sell Linux systems in the United Kingdom. "[Acer models] with Ubuntu pre-loaded are available at the factory level. However, there is no demand for it in the U.K. Therefore, those configurations are not an option [for U.K. customers] at the moment," said an Acer spokesperson.

Acer America also doesn't plan to ship any products with Ubuntu linux-pre loaded: "For now, Acer America has no plans for Ubuntu on our Aspire or TravelMate PC lines," said Alison Williams, Acer company spokesperson.

Dell has seen enough interest in Dell Ubuntu Linux products for the company to have a number of new products in the pipeline. Before the ad surfaced a few days ago on the Internet, consumers expected Dell to remain the only company offering a pre-loaded Linux product.

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Uses for Linux

By DonkeyRhubarb on 8/1/2007 6:37:38 PM , Rating: 3

I used to have SUSE on my main PC, but it held me back too much for what I use my main PC for.

If I had it on my lappy, it would do me for documents and web browsing. PERFECT!

Gaming on my main PC was not really possible on Linux, so I use Vista.(Works well for me since beta!)

So to summarise Id happily get a laptop with Linux, just not a main PC;-)

RE: Uses for Linux

By Cogman on 8/1/2007 6:55:58 PM , Rating: 2

Did you ever try wine? Provided it isn't perfect but it has come a long way from when I used it first. If you have linux installed anywhere go to http://www.winehq.com read up on your specific app's and see if wine can run them.

I agree though, linux needs to crack gaming before they will start to see a larger amount of users switch over. It works great as an Office PC but lacks in a few places as a home PC (actually it only really just lacks in gamming as a home PC.)

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RE: Uses for Linux

By Moishe on 8/2/2007 7:42:19 AM , Rating: 2

Doesn't wine need Windows to run windows apps or am I thinking of something else?

I think Gaming is not why Linux is not winning... it's a small part maybe, but "office" users are by far the most popular and if anything, having a very nice standard office setup in Linux would cover a lot of bases. But I don't see Microsoft making a Linux version of MS Office anytime soon.

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RE: Uses for Linux

By omnicronx on 8/2/2007 10:42:26 AM , Rating: 2

wine really does suck when it comes to games, i have been using it for a while. I still use it for windows applications (word etc etc..) but for games it is usually quite useless.
There is another program though which unfortunately you have to pay for but it is totally worth it. Its called Cedega, which still uses wine but it was developed just for games. Via update they support more and more games everyday. Of course you cant play new games the day they come out, but give it a few weeks and an update usually appears.

as for the post below, OpenOffice is a good solution although not as powerful as MSOFFICE. but as i said before, with a little tweaking, you can get office to work via wine in linux too ;)

p.s Nvidia cards usually work better for games (for me atl east) although ati has really stepped in up in the linux drivers department, i get better fps using an nvidia card.

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RE: Uses for Linux

By mmarq on 8/2/2007 12:09:41 PM , Rating: 2

quote:
wine really does suck when it comes to games, i have been using it for a while. I still use it for windows applications (word etc etc..) but for games it is usually quite useless.
There is another program though which unfortunately you have to pay for but it is totally worth it. Its called Cedega, which still uses wine but it was developed just for games. Via update they support more and more games everyday. Of course you cant play new games the day they come out, but give it a few weeks and an update usually appears.

Magic ! Just make all your troubles disappear.

http://lifehacker.com/software/how-to/turn-a-windo...

vmware player is free... and with a lit bit of work and incite it could work for almost all distros.

Want better ?

Just use one Windows machine as a Application server... easy, because so many people nowadays just have more than 1 machine.

http://www.2x.com/applicationserver/asfeatures.htm

It just 'publishes' on your desktop, only window by window, the applications running in the server . That is, you wont see another Windows(tm) desktop inside an X window, as is usually when using a VM with another OS.

You can have a symlink for a game running on the application server, and upon click you'll get a X window on your desk with the game running and in full screen if you like. X allows that.

You can have a game rig for games and window applications(without IE or other crap) and a lower spec rig for Linux desktop that it wont make a difference. You'll get the best of both worlds.

In your Linux desktop machine you'll have to install Thinstation, because the service is terminal services trough the NX or RDS protocol... it worths the effort.
http://thinstation.sourceforge.net/wiki/index.php/...

Its much more complicated but you even could cluster balance 2 or more machines trough OpenMosix

http://www.ibm.com/developerworks/linux/library/l-...

For more possibilities just see my post(mmarq) at http://lwn.net/Articles/240822/

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RE: Uses for Linux

By PrinceGaz on 8/1/2007 7:54:13 PM , Rating: 2

It is only because of gaming I don't use Ubuntu as my main day-to-day OS on this PC. Pretty much everything else I need to do can be done equally well when running Ubuntu, except of course games.

That means a dual-boot of Ubuntu and Widnows XP is necessary (adding Vista as a triple-boot alternative would be insane until at least Vista SP1 is released; given the state of the graphics-card drivers, and other memory-management related issues).

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RE: Uses for Linux

By Hare on 8/1/2007 11:56:18 PM , Rating: 2

quote:
(adding Vista as a triple-boot alternative would be insane until at least Vista SP1 is released; given the state of the graphics-card drivers, and other memory-management related issues).

Care to elaborate? Memory management works fine and graphics card drivers have been good for months and months. So what exactly is wrong with these two?

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RE: Uses for Linux

By rgsaunders on 8/2/2007 12:09:54 AM , Rating: 2

I would beg to differ on the graphics driver issue, at least in the case of nVidia drivers. I have been using Vista since it was in beta, and the graphics drivers still leave a lot to be desired. I can't speak to the issue of ATI drivers in Vista as I haven't tried them, but its only the last couple of versions of the nVidia drivers that have approached functionality. The gaming issues that may exist are of no relevance to me, but multi-screen independent graphics modes have a long ways to go before they match their current development under XP.

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RE: Uses for Linux

By Hare on 8/2/2007 1:34:28 AM , Rating: 2

I have two rigs, Ati and nVidia. The gaming performance and multiple monitor/tv features were problematic with nVidia but these have been pretty much fixed. I've used a dual monitor setup with Vista (+nVidia) about 6 months without any real issues. Same with Ati (also a dual monitor setup). I've had zero problems with Ati drivers on Vista. Performance is good and no issues with multiple monitors / tv-out / games.

I would say that problems existed maybe 4-5 months ago but the situation currently isn't any "worse" than with XP.

The previous poster also mentioned memory management. That's funny since XP's memory management is very inefficient and poor. Vista on the other hand finally features a smart caching feature just like all the other real OS's have done for ages (Mac OS X, Linux etc). Just because an OS uses all the available memory for caching doesn't make it bad. In fact, it's just the opposite.

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RE: Uses for Linux

By OrSin on 8/2/2007 9:21:20 AM , Rating: 1

I got 3 vista systems and NV drivers for game are not great.
I never get lock up in game with the ATI systems and get them alot with vista. Also vista does a realy bad job when compressed files and IDE drives. It still have some issues. With that said i still like vista, but its here yet. One thing I can say I have had the new patch on for a week and so far the compressed file thing is alot faster and no crashs on the games I play so it might have fixed my issues. I have only played each game twice so i need to play more to "test" it out. Yes playing games is work for me, if my family ask anyone. :)

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RE: Uses for Linux

By Ringold on 8/2/2007 6:04:22 PM , Rating: 2

There's a good number of indy games (like Space Empires V) that's still got huge problems with nvidia drivers. ATi drivers, not so much, but under Vista x64 editions that's only recently been ironed out on the ATi side completely; not "months and months". New drivers still, due to AMD and NVidia's lack of concern for small titles, can either represent improvements or introduce new problems bad enough to warrant rolling back.

Of course, I'm nit-picking as small titles understandably arent a big concern early on in a driver sets life. But XP drivers have absolutely no comparable problems.

I typically defend Vista, but I wouldn't make a blanket statement that its near as reliable as XP. It's hard to build up years of testing, driver optimization and application fixes in just the 5 or so months it's been available to the mass market.

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RE: Uses for Linux

By omnicronx on 8/2/2007 10:47:13 AM , Rating: 2

The latest nvidia drivers really helped me out; finally has overscan and the dual monitor support is much better. I feel both nvidia and ati drivers are lacking at the moment in vista, but since the june release of the nvidia drivers, i have noticed many problems i did have disappeared. I did hear from a friend and reviews online that nvidia sli drivers are just terrible, and are in need of a major update.

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RE: Uses for Linux

By PrinceGaz on 8/3/2007 11:00:55 AM , Rating: 2

quote:
Care to elaborate? Memory management works fine and graphics card drivers have been good for months and months. So what exactly is wrong with these two?

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?...

If you're a gamer, Vista uses up the available 2GB address-space long before XP does, causing the most demanding games to crash. You can tweak how the address space is allocated so that as much as 3GB is available in XP and Vista, but the Vista system will still run out of space first.

Maybe Vista memory management does work fine and it is supposed to use more virtual address space for whatever reason, but then that would make it clearly inferior to XP.

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RE: Uses for Linux

By PrinceGaz on 8/3/2007 11:06:19 AM , Rating: 2

I'll just add to the above:

...clearly inferior to XP, until 64-bit versions of games are mainstream and 64-bit Vista graphics drivers are rock-solid.

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RE: Uses for Linux

By psyph3r on 8/1/2007 8:11:35 PM , Rating: 2

I would run solely linux if they supported DX gaming at 100% performance

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RE: Uses for Linux

By Jack Ripoff on 8/2/2007 9:36:33 PM , Rating: 2

Am I wrong or isn't a Cedega license cheaper than a Vista license?

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The solution to the gaming problem

By ethana2 on 8/2/2007 12:32:26 AM , Rating: 2

open frag.

When OSS for gaming gets as awesome as the Linux kernel, well, just imagine.

One game library for 17 games. Developed by performance freaks, Runs on every platform in existence. (XBOX, PS3, MAC, PC, PC with SLI/crossfire and XBOX360 controller, PC with decent GPU, 2 candles, and Wiimotes ;)

Sounds good to me. Give 'em a little time- and support if possible.

What I'm trying to do is convince the people at AlienTrap(Nexuiz-dev) and Tremulous dev to port to open frag. Unity is the first step.

With that I cry- "Linux gamers of the world, UNITE!"

RE: The solution to the gaming problem

By darkpaw on 8/2/2007 9:31:55 AM , Rating: 2

quote:
With that I cry- "Linux gamers of the world, UNITE!"

And with that statement 5 or 6 30 year olds living in their parents basements around the world spent hours trying to get a single game to run on Linux at 15fps.

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RE: The solution to the gaming problem

By omnicronx on 8/2/2007 10:52:23 AM , Rating: 2

do you still live in 1998? Linux drivers are much better than they used to be, when playing many games with Cedega, i get close to 90% of the fps i would get in windows.

one of the many misconceptions of Linux today. I have been using nix for many years watching it grow, and linux is finally starting to break out of the "ONLY FOR GEEKS" mentality, comments like yours really dont help though.

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RE: The solution to the gaming problem

By darkpaw on 8/2/2007 11:19:24 AM , Rating: 2

Why pay for an additonal program to kindasorta run games in Linux when you can just run them in Windows without problems?

Linux is definately way better then it was in 98, but its still a headache to do many things that are easier to just do in Windows.

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RE: The solution to the gaming problem

By omnicronx on 8/2/2007 12:04:38 PM , Rating: 2

Cedega is in version 6 now, I am not talking kind of sorta, it plays most games you can play in windows, and if you want to use linux and still play games, its the program for you.
If you are a heavy, I ONLY PLAY games user, then of course windows is for you. But if you want a break from windows, and you only play the occasional game cedega is a very good option.

I myself use Vista on my main machine because i have to run a lot of products that are windows only, but this is not the case for 75% of the users out there.

Just by the way you are talking i can tell you have no idea what you are talking about when it comes to linux. Linux has really changed in the past few years especially with user friendly distros such as ubuntu, which makes migration from windows pretty easy, and reacts alot like windows in many ways. If you dont like linux, don't use it, but let everyone else decide for themselves if its still 'a headache to do many things that are easier to just do in Windows'

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RE: The solution to the gaming problem

By darkpaw on 8/2/2007 12:44:39 PM , Rating: 2

Actually, I use Linux almost everyday because a lot of the tools I need to do my job are designed for it. That said outside of security work and web servers (where it is generally vastly superior) I personally think its a PITA for day to day use.

Sure if someone is just going to browse their web and check their email its fine on the desktop, but the minute you want to run any kind of commercial software you need to work a lot harder then just install and go.

Cedega I admit I have no experience with, but thats just because I've never seen a reason to pay to run games on Linux or mess with emulation.

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RE: The solution to the gaming problem

By omnicronx on 8/2/2007 1:22:48 PM , Rating: 2

quote:
Sure if someone is just going to browse their web and check their email its fine on the desktop,

but thats exactly my point, there is a very high number of people (i know i said 75% but its at least over 50%) use their computers for just that. Yet Linux is still on less than 1% of pc's.

you are perfectly correct on the fact if you want commercial software you may be out of luck. ( i say may because there are many open source Linux alternatives to many windows programs) But the fact remains linux could be used by many more people than its current 'geek' fan base.

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RE: The solution to the gaming problem

By Ringold on 8/2/2007 6:18:40 PM , Rating: 1

I'm going to have to (surprise) disagree a little..

I've spent the last 3 days off and on trying to get networking to work correctly (it randomly failed) in Sabayon 3.4a. It's otherwise great, but that was a PITA deal breaker. Mint and PCLOS was okay, but hell, x86? I've had x86-64 Windows since the week XP 64bit edition came out. So then today put on Ubuntu x86-64, and then tried to do something that made me decide that "newb friendly" Linux is a hugely misleading label.

Sure, if you don't need anything not in Synaptic, you're in good shape. If everything works out of the box, then sweet deal. If obscure apps being a little out of date doesn't bother you, cool beans. But lets say you want to install the latest version of BOINC or Folding@Home? You do a little googling, and quickly discover all sorts of talk about chroot, cron, rc, and all kinds of bullshit Linux terminology that only a geek could understand. And if drivers don't automagically configure after boot? May the gods have mercy on your n00b soul! Oh, and not a communist? Avoid the OSS-only crowd, lest you get a brow beating for not having deep fundamental misgivings about the fact that your music is in an evil capitalist non-"Free" file format.

No, n00b-Friendly Linux just really means Geek-Friendly; Linux with minimal headaches. Unless, of course, one is totally inept, and then they just dont know any better, where Windows would likely still be easier -- but more dangerous.

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I reckon its because

By Amiga500 on 8/2/2007 4:36:03 AM , Rating: 2

People realise they can download linux for free - but also realise they might be getting windows xp for a reduced price if they buy it bundled with a computer. ;-)

wrong headline?

By Gul Westfale on 8/1/07, Rating: -1

RE: wrong headline?

By someguy123 on 8/1/2007 7:27:32 PM , Rating: 3

not sure why you are so hostile towards acer's comments. all they're saying is that no one wants to buy a prebuilt linux system in the UK. the majority of the time, if you're buying a prebuilt system you aren't very computer savvy, or you are lazy and like things streamlined. both characteristics would lead a person away from buying a linux machine.

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