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Front side of 40GB PlayStation 3 shows only two USB ports and no memory card reader  (Source: SCEE)
SCEA president confirms incoming 40GB PlayStation 3 model

With the 40GB PlayStation 3 already loose and about in Europe, and a Ceramic White colored one bound for Japan, it’s nearly certain that a fourth PS3 SKU will be touching North American shores in time for the holiday buying season.

While SCEA’s public relations department has been strangely mum on the upcoming console, SCEA president Jack Tretton spilled the beans to Reuters early Thursday morning. Tretton said that the 40GB model will launch on November 2 at the expected price of $399.99.

Matching up with analyst expectations, the price of the 80GB model will fall the $499.99 – the price currently held by the 60GB PlayStation 3, which are becoming a retail rarity since Sony stopped producing it.

Like the 40GB PlayStation 3 hardware that is hitting the rest of the globe, the one bound for North America also will be without any form of backwards compatibility for PlayStation 2 titles. Original PlayStation games will still be playable through software emulation, but 40GB PS3 will be unable to support any PS2 games due to the removal of both the Emotion Engine and Graphics Synthesizer.

Dedicated PS2 hardware was first removed in the European PlayStation 3, and later the 80GB North American model, but those were still able to play a limited number of legacy titles. The new 40GB model will eschew classic games altogether, which Sony says is to better focus on making PlayStation 3 games rather than concentrating on making older PS2 games run on its newest hardware.

With the PS2 consistently outselling the newer PS3, Sony is still mass manufacturing the previous generation hardware. "We're choosing to focus on the PlayStation 2 consumer with the PlayStation 2, which remains incredibly relevant, and focus on the PlayStation 3 consumer with the new 40-gigabyte model and the great software coming out," Tretton said. "Backward compatibility is a nice secondary consideration, but it's far from the number-one priority."

The 40GB PlayStation is also equipped with two fewer USB ports and no memory card reader, which are available on the 80GB model, as a further cost-reducing measure. Tretton made no mention of the expected Spider-Man 3 Blu-ray Disc pack-in, though details of that may be saved for the pending official announcement.

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That's great
By novacthall on 10/18/2007 8:33:25 AM , Rating: 5
I'm not being sarcastic. Really, it is. Just show me the games.

I have been thoroughly unimpressed with PS3's game offerings so far. At least by this point in PS2's life cycle, we had an Ace Combat game, Onimusha, Gran Turismo, Silent Hill 2, Devil May Cry, GTA3 (late October, I know, but I'm throwing it in the hat anyway), SSX and SSX Tricky on the way. What have we got to do on PS3 right now?

Beans, that's what. Show me the games, Sony. Show me the games and you've got an easy buyer in me.

RE: That's great
By Chaser on 10/18/2007 9:15:34 AM , Rating: 4
I looked at Best Buy yesterday. On the shelves some of the games there were Oblivion, Folklore, Motorstorm, Heavenly Sword, Warhawk, Fear, Resistance Fall of Man, Virtua Fighter 5, several good pro sports games that good good reviews. And several more I can't remember. Although for the average buyer whats on the shelves at the time matters most theres several good titles that are going to be released in December and January 2008.

And before all the 360 Fanbois launch an assault on my reply all I am saying is for someone that is not a PC gaming genius is looking to buy a PS3 for gaming those aren't bad titles. Yes of course theres zillions more for the 360 and yes the incredible Halo 3, but to say there are "no games" for the PS3 is inaccurate.

RE: That's great
By Chaser on 10/18/2007 9:17:49 AM , Rating: 2
Not saying you novacthall but it is said often by many on this forum.

RE: That's great
By bkm32 on 10/18/2007 9:35:21 AM , Rating: 2
You're absolutely right; there a bunch of great games for the PS3. Sure, there aren't as many as on the X360 (but more than the Wii); however, there are a couple orders of magnitude more on the PS2, which will not (in any capacity according to the article) be supported on the PS3.

As a PS2 owner, this sucks, big time and again makes Sony's Tretton out to be a liar. Kutaragi may have been ecentric (read "nut-house crazy"), but at least he was honest.

RE: That's great
By Chaser on 10/18/2007 9:52:05 AM , Rating: 2
For me to be honest I'm more a PC gamer not a console guy. The PS3 is my first console ever because I felt at the time my PC would cover many of the 360 games that would come out and so I'd have more of a chance of getting some non PC/360 "exclusives" if I went PS3. Yes obviously that hasn't happened yet but from my point of view PS2 compatibility really wasn't a huge priority to me like it seems to be for others. Some people in this forum state that a lack of PS2 compatibility is the "kiss of death" for the PS3. I disagree. Sure its nice to have one device for all and I can appreciate that but I think cutting costs on the PS3 to make it more affordable was a smart trade off for those considering a new console. I have the 60GB and its kinda nice knowing I have the emotion engine hardware in mine but not that big of a deal to me personally.

RE: That's great
By Zoomer on 10/19/2007 7:31:49 PM , Rating: 2
Final Fantasy. Coming in a year, by most accounts. :)

RE: That's great
By Legionosh on 10/18/2007 10:13:41 AM , Rating: 4
I think you misunderstand what everyones means when they say there are "no games" for the PS3.

They are mainly referring to exclusives that are worth paying $500-$600 for (soon to be $400-500, but I think the lack of PS2 backwards compatibility is going to raise more of a fuss from the consumer than Sony cares to admit...yes that's a different topic but it does need to be mentioned in relation to this article).

Games like VF5 and Oblivion are either A) on the way to the 360 (with added features) or B) were there before the PS3 was launched (The PS3 version of Oblivion was slightly better, but not enough to make any real mention of).

Then there is the situation with most 3rd party games being superior on the 360 for one reason or another. That is supposed to change soon and games will be the same on both consoles, but for the time being that statement is true.

Folklore has been averaging about a 7.0, and after playing the demo a couple of times I have to agree. I was eagerly waiting for the demo and when it came out I hopped on it the minute it was available..and I was really disappointed. I guess I was expecting something else, but I still think the 7.0 average is about right.

Resistance was good, but there was something about it I didn't like, so I ended up not buying it. It wasn't something I could put my finger on, but it still seems like a good game none the less, just not my cup O' tea so to speak.

Motorstorm is fun, but far from the CGI "in game" footage everyone was shown at E3 2005 (2006?). Not a big deal but still when you promise something like that and you deliver something far less than what was promised, well people DO tend to take notice.

Heavenly Sword is really good, but also really short. Beat it in one day and then what? Halo 3's single player campaign may not be much longer, but the multiplayer aspect will keep fans coming back for a long time.

Warhawk? I haven't played it or the demo so I can't say anything about it. Maybe it's a great game. The reviews have been good so I'll go with it being worth owning if you are interested in playing a multiplayer only game.

I see you left out Lair (I assume that was on People rag on Lair, but that's mainly because it was hyped as one of Sonys biggest titles for the holidays...and Gamespot gives it a 4.5. Gamespot is harsh when it needs to be so I tend to agree with most of their reviews (unless it's something blatantly wrong, but that doesn't happen too often).

Not to mention, if most games are on both consoles (save for the exclusives) and one console cost significantly less, which one do you think most customers would opt for?

..and please no "well adding HD-DVD cost $180, adding wi-fi.." argument. To game out of the box you pay $350 for a 360. HD cables, headset and all.

Yes, XBox live GOLD is an extra $7 a month (or $50-$60 a year), but I'll pay that as the LIVE service is heads and tails above anything the PSN can least at the present time? Will home change that? We'll see when it becomes available.

The $400 PS3 will definitely shake things up though (as will the drop to $500 for the 80GB), but I still feel the lack of PS2 backwards compatibility on the 40GB is going to bother a lot of people.

I am in Gamestop all the time (my friend also works there) and he and I see people all the time buying PS2 games to play on their PS3...heck I do it myself as I own a 60GB. So to think it will have no affect on the fans, in my opinion, is a big mistake on Sonys part.

Maybe when there are more games on the PS3 this won't matter as much, and there will more than likely come a time when it won't matter at all, but I don't think that time is now.

So in closing, sure there are games for the PS3..but are they worth buying a PS3 for when the 360 offers a better 3rd party game experience and some extremely good titles for this holiday season?


RE: That's great
By michal1980 on 10/18/07, Rating: 0
RE: That's great
By Legionosh on 10/18/2007 12:58:11 PM , Rating: 2
..I read a few reviews on Folklore..I'm pretty sure I read IGNs as well.

The demo was short, but all demos are. The story I guess was ok, but I didn't care for the storytelling, nor the quirky style of the game (I am all for quirky games mind you..I guess I expected this game to be much "darker" than it was, hence why I stated that it was different from what I was expecting).

..and with most reviews of Folklore being in the 7.x range I can't see them all being wrong and the one lone high score being the only accurate one. The law of averages can be applied

I think Halo 3's single player is a hair longer (depending on difficulty level on course), and Heavenly Sword does look better (although Halo isn't the most graphically impressive games on the 360 anyway. I'd give that one to probably Bioshock or Gears of War).

In regards to the story being better for HS, that could be argued, but since I haven't played HS I can't comment on that, but most people are satisfied with the story..


RE: That's great
By Chaser on 10/18/2007 11:38:13 AM , Rating: 2
Kevin I believe your analysis come from a very technically well informed consumer's point of view.

with the holidays coming up and the $399 PS3 (with Spiderman 3 on Blue Ray per USA Today) many potential shoppers urged on by their kids or Mom's shopping for Christmas aren't going subject their purchase choice with the level of analysis of the details as much as you and many others on this forum do.

However, I agree that the simple statement of "well the 360 has more games" is obviously undeniable.

I also believe that the 360 is first and foremost a U.S. console. Whereas the PS3 balances out (at least some) with mostly better worldwide sales numbers. For many Europeans, Japanese and others they simple won't buy a 360 just to avoid M$ in anyway they can despite anything else. And thats not a personal bias for me. I think its great the 360 does well. I don't need one "to win" over the other to feel good.

To me brand loyalty is a factor to consider and perhaps brand disloyalty against anything from Microsoft for many in the UK, Australia, Japan and elsewhere is also a significant factor.

RE: That's great
By Legionosh on 10/18/2007 1:11:59 PM , Rating: 2
Chaser..what can I say, I read a

..but seriously, I do try to keep up to date on everything just so I know what's new, changes etc..and even if I sometimes seem to "rag" on a console it's always from a logical and a (usually) fact backed standpoint when at all possible..makes for a much more interesting argument when the fanboys start whining.

..and yes most shoppers (aka "little johnnys parents") aren't going to know anything..

..but you are right. If a customer can see things as simple as a larger game library then it can sway them one way or the other. The $400 price point will help Sony no doubt, but when the uninformed customer finds out his PS2 library doesn't work in his new PS3, I can see this raising a few tempers..

I think the 360s only real issue is the RROD. They shouldn't found a way to resolve this months ago...maybe the falcon and Jasper (?) chip revisions will fix that once and for all. That is the only complaint I hear from shoppers.

..that being said it IS one HECK of a

Like you I don't avoid console X because company Y made it. It doesn't matter to me (although I do wish Phil Harrison and all the other egotistical heads of Sony Corp would go jump off a bridge..but that's just

The PS3 is a nice piece of tech, and I am glad I have a 60GB instead of a hampered 80GB or a crippled new 40GB..still I will be happier when the "good" games get here. :-)


RE: That's great
By Locutus465 on 10/18/2007 1:44:14 PM , Rating: 2
Agreed with reliability being MS's biggest issue ATM (they're working on it apparently). I have a newer console that was doing great up till last night (HDMI enabled Premium). On the glass is half full side of life for MS it's not a classic RROD (though I do get a red light on the bottom right quarter of the ring). At least to the best of my knowlege classic RROD is a full red ring + no picture. Mine is getting the lower right side lit up red and an error message on screen "E 74" with hardware error written in multiple languages.

According to "the web" sometimes removing the HD or some paripherials will clear up this error, but no good in my case. Removed the HD, HD-DVD drive and kept the wireless controllers turned off and connected to the TV via composit inputs, still broken...

Now, to include a glass is half full for me... While my x-box is dead and my Wii is lent out to a certain speacial someone who is unfortunetly way to far away from me.... MS is not just sending me a shipping lable... They're sending me a shipping label + box + packing material + detailed packing instructions... When my Wii died all I got was a label, which was fine packing costs were about $6 anyway. And as if saving me the $6 wasn't enough, MS is also throwing in free XBL gold time (I think a month or so)...

Moral of the story here? Apparnetly I just don't mix well with next gen consoles! lol.... A bumb wii and a bumb x-box... Last gen I bought a new x-box and a used game cube... Never had any trouble with any of them (same girl that has my Wii ATM also has my old GC which still works perfectly, her sister has my XB1 and that still works great too).

RE: That's great
By Legionosh on 10/18/2007 1:57:07 PM , Rating: 2 HDMI premium? I know those are only a few months old at I hate it for you. That really, really sucks.

My launch 360 needed to be replaced 1-2 months after launch, but the new one ran fine until it was traded in towards an Elite, which is holding up well.

(my box for my launch unit repair came with a label on one side, and the instructions specifically said to put the new label on a different side. Since I was scared to mess something up, I did exactly what it said...and my console ended up being lost for 2 they found it and shipped me a new console in it's place) :-)

(I also run a Nyko cooling fan. Even if it does add noise I'd rather deal with that rather the heat be in the console.)

But like you I hope they fix the RROD issue once and for all. I wonder how many more consoles they would have sold had people not been so hesitent due to the contant talk of "hardware failures"..

..and a Wii? Sounds like a stroke of bad luck...are you sure you didn't make Chuck Norris angry or something? wrath is beyond measure. ;-)

..sadly it seems the PS3 is the most reliable so far this gen.. to hoping thing MS can fix this issue once and for all..


RE: That's great
By Locutus465 on 10/18/2007 2:28:54 PM , Rating: 2
Well, kudos to Sony for building one solid machine... They got something right that is for sure.... Honestly I don't think this failure can be attributed to heat... Frankly the console didn't run exessivly hot, at least not by my standards.... And I did run it for 4 hour halo 3 marathons with some friends shortly after the halo 3 launch (fortunetly I already have my normal and heroic "badges").

Actually, I have a suspision that the trouble may end up proving to be a bumb DVD drive... I have no real firm evidence to back this up other than strange clacking & "electronic" noises when the system starts trying to boot. I could be wrong though.... Again, on the glass is half full side of life (at least for MS) this does not appear to be a RROD....

I'm also not prepared to say that current gen consoles aren't just fine in general based on my experiences... There are bound to be bumb hardware always... It's possible I just got a broken one... There's no dening though that this isn't the kind of thing MS needs... Perhaps something they can learn from Sony is how to build an effective hardware QA system.

RE: That's great
By nayy on 10/18/2007 11:38:58 AM , Rating: 2
I Agree with most of your arguments, but you seem to have a lot of free time to write that kind of post, lol

Personally I this is good news to me, I'm about to get me a 360, and this is sure to put pressure to Microsoft to offer something better than two free games, especially considering that with PS3 you get BR and 5 free movies, no that i care about that, but it certainly raises the ante.

RE: That's great
By Legionosh on 10/18/2007 1:25:57 PM , Rating: 2
..yeah, works been a little slow this

..and I also agree MS needs to counter this with more than Marvel:UA and Forza2. While I really like Forza 2 it just isn't enough. Plain and simple.

The PS3 is too close in price now to just assume the 360 console will outsell it based soley on it's current library, however superior it may be. Whether MS likes it or not the PS3 offers a lot more "out of the box"..HD cables excluded of course (the 40GB still doesn't come with HD cables does it?)

While HD (HD-DVD or Blu-Ray) hasn't gone mainstream yet, it is slowly but surely gaining popularity, especially as HDTVs become more mainstream...heck even BestBuy announced they'd no longer carry analog TVs. Not sure if they meant it will only be HDTVs only though..

..and Sony has HD (Blu-Ray anyway) out of the box. It is the better "value" hardware wise without question.

So they definitely need to counter the new 40GB and the lower 80GB with some sort of a price drop.

..although I don't honestly see them doing it. Don't ask me why, but I don't see MS doing a price cut to counter this, but if they were smart they would. Call it a gut feeling, but I just don't see it.

Then again on the last (only) 360 price cut I was 500% certain the new price levels would be $200, $300 and $400, and I was way wrong (as were SEVERAL other people who predicted the same thing) maybe I'll be way wrong here.

It would be nice to be wrong, but I just don't see it.

..and 5 free movies is always a plus (made me upset as I bought my HD-DVD add-on the day it was released, so I missed out on the deal..that's what I get for being an early


RE: That's great
By Zoomer on 10/19/2007 7:33:43 PM , Rating: 2
Does ps2 games look better on the ps3 when played on a HDTV?

By bkm32 on 10/18/2007 9:29:10 AM , Rating: 2
The new 40GB model will eschew classic games altogether, which Sony says is to better focus on making PlayStation 3 games rather than concentrating on making older PS2 games run on its newest hardware.

Isn't Sony alienating a possible 40 million strong North American installed userbase by making them pay 100 bucks more for only limited backward capability (in the 80G). Wasn't this a huge selling point to this device? Wasn't this the real reason Sony added a game machine to their next generation DVD player?

I think this has the potential to be a terrible move on Sony's part.

Maybe they should just include a PS2 with every PS3 purchase (a two-fer) or reduce the PS2 price to just $99.

RE: PS2-less
By ChipDude on 10/18/2007 10:01:44 AM , Rating: 2
Nothing like ignoring your biggest and most loyal customer base.

Another brilliant move with stupid spin by Sony. why bother saving the few tens of dollars by eliminating the compatiblity.

Show us some good games, not just games, and backward compatiblity and I might bite.

its a 360 and halo for my boys this christmas. Had PS3 been fully backward compatible that might have swayed me to a PS3....

Sorry sony, guranteed 3rd place this time around

RE: PS2-less
By snooze091 on 10/18/2007 10:27:31 AM , Rating: 3
The loyal customer base that already has a PS2? You could just pay an extra $100 if it's that important. Fanboy.

few tens of dollars ($40?) (40 x few million = ?)

RE: PS2-less
By SPAMSPAMSPAM on 10/18/2007 12:38:47 PM , Rating: 2
Im personally debating on getting a 40 gig ps3 or not. If i do get one, I'll be replacing the hard drive with a 250 gig laptop drive from newegg.

RE: PS2-less
By Fillibuster on 10/18/2007 1:11:15 PM , Rating: 2
You know what those loyal customers own? A PS2. Is it going to blow up when they get the 40GB and render their PS2 game collection useless? Yes it is not as easy as playing games on one system, but how many people sell their systems off? And of the people who do, don't you think they would check about BC before they sold it off? I believe the lack of BC is being blown way out of proportion.

(On a BC related sidenote-who in the hell would get rid of their PS2 before Guitar Hero 3 comes out? lol)

And as far as the "limited" BC goes on the 80GB I believe its around 95-96% (don't have a source on hand but do a search). When is the last time the 360 updated the BC? (I only play Halo 1 & 2 as far as my 360 BC goes)

RE: PS2-less
By MrPickins on 10/18/2007 5:29:57 PM , Rating: 2
(On a BC related sidenote-who in the hell would get rid of their PS2 before Guitar Hero 3 comes out? lol)

The people buying GH3 for 360, PS3 or Wii.

RE: PS2-less
By wallijonn on 10/18/2007 12:46:27 PM , Rating: 2
Isn't Sony alienating a possible 40 million strong North American installed userbase by making them pay 100 bucks more for only limited backward capability (in the 80G). Wasn't this a huge selling point to this device? Wasn't this the real reason Sony added a game machine to their next generation DVD player?

Those who bought 360s also have limited backwards compatibility. It doesn't matter if the PS3 has PS2 compatibility if one can't find the games. Sony needs to keep re-releasing their "Greatest Hits" series. (I still haven't been able to find "ICO," although I just 'found' "Klonoa 2"). Then there is the problem of playing a PS2 game that doesn't look very good compared to a PS3 game. So in this respect it isn't all that dissimilar from the 360 coming out and leaving all the original XBox gamers in a lurch (since they were two different architectures.)

Personally, I see the 360 Arcade as being the better value (since it, like the PS3, won't have any backwards compatibility) at $280 vs $400. Yes, you could make the case for a $145 Blue Ray player ($120 + $24.95 for the BR remote. Will people be duped into paying $99.99 for the PS3 HDMI cable or will Bestbuy steer them to the $70 Monster Cable HDMI? Many may feel like paying no more than $20 for a cable. The PS3 should have an HDMI cable pack in.)

The problem is that people who are cost conscious will probably balk at paying $30 to $35 for a BR movie. So they will have to buy the BR movies when they go on sales for $19.99 apiece. Then comes the selection of BR movies which are currently available, the same problem which plagues HD-DVD (not that many would want BR versions of older movies, mind you, since the video quality may not be up to the standards of current theatre releases.)

RE: PS2-less
By murphyslabrat on 10/18/2007 1:42:27 PM , Rating: 2
You know the difference between PS2/PS3 vs. X-Box/X-Box 360? Both X-Boxes are huge, and most of the people with a PS2 have the slim one.

RE: PS2-less
By deeznuts on 10/18/2007 1:06:32 PM , Rating: 3
Isn't Sony alienating a possible 40 million strong North American installed userbase by making them pay 100 bucks more for only limited backward capability (in the 80G).
Umm, they already have a PS2, or they can buy the 80GB. Plain and simple.

Buying a 360 or a Wii isn't going to help them play their PS2 games either, so they are not really alienating their fanbase.

By andrewrocks on 10/18/2007 7:22:50 AM , Rating: 1
so when will the 80GBs be $499?

you "people" keep saying this

RE: interesting...
By peritusONE on 10/18/2007 8:15:58 AM , Rating: 3
According to this article and the one at Reuters, the price will drop to $499 the same day. I'm still contemplating picking one up, even though the backwards compatibility is gone from the $399 SKU. That is one of the reasons I was considering the PS3, so I could catch up on some PS2 games I've missed out on the past couple of years.

RE: interesting...
By Murst on 10/18/2007 10:29:54 AM , Rating: 2
If you're waiting for the 80GB to drop to $500, I'd strongly consider getting the 60GB version.

Another thing that was not mentioned is what the price of the remaining 60GB models will be. I would not be surprised to see them at $450.

RE: interesting...
By Legionosh on 10/18/2007 12:47:33 PM , Rating: 2

..actually the $499 80GB price drop is effective immediately..and Gamestops web site confirms this.


RE: interesting...
By Murst on 10/18/2007 2:16:39 PM , Rating: 2
Hmm... looks like they're not dropping the 60GB price...

Both the 80GB and 60GB are listed at $500.

RE: interesting...
By Bytre on 10/18/2007 10:22:51 PM , Rating: 2
The store has the 80gb version at $499 now. I've been waiting for that, to couple with the $150 rebate for signing up for the sony chase card.

I'll pay $350 for a blu-ray player which happens to play games.

By psypher on 10/18/2007 8:19:28 AM , Rating: 2
I finally convinced my girlfriend that it was actually a good idea for me to get a PS3. This is perfect timing.

RE: Sweet
By theapparition on 10/18/2007 9:29:37 AM , Rating: 3
Maybe you could convice her to give your manhood back.....

RE: Sweet
By dwo on 10/18/2007 9:37:59 AM , Rating: 2
Maybe you could convice her to give your manhood back.....

I am betting your single.

To the original "sweet" poster could you please let me know how you conviced her that it was a good idea? I have had no luck and would like to find out how you pulled it off so i can compare notes

RE: Sweet
By psypher on 10/18/07, Rating: 0
RE: Sweet
By AlphaVirus on 10/18/2007 10:29:42 AM , Rating: 3
I can agree, he must be single.

What is the secret to convince the spouse its a good idea a PS3 is a good investment?

Some movie she watched made her think twice about me getting a console. It had two ladies talking and one was having relationship issues, the other said "If you want to keep getting sex, dont buy him a nintendo" So now my wife does not want me to get a gaming console because she thinks she wont get it anymore.... Damn those soap operas!

RE: Sweet
By RubberJohnny on 10/18/2007 9:31:51 PM , Rating: 2
Its all good dude, go get yourself a wii and tell the misses i'll take over the daily (weekly, monthly?!?) duties that you were too busy to do ;)

By mdogs444 on 10/18/2007 8:26:04 AM , Rating: 2
So what exactly does the new SCC filing that we heard about a few days ago entail? Is it going to be a new PS3 version all together - perhaps a HD-less version at less than $399, or is it going to be a new color like Silver?

RE: Hmm
By AlexWade on 10/18/2007 8:35:07 AM , Rating: 2
It won't be Blu-ray less. Sony is betting the farm that PS3 will ensure a Blu-ray victory. It won't, of course, because most consumers only care about pushing play and the PS3 will always be a video game machine to them. LG and Samsung have the right idea, play both formats. When those hit a good price, that is what I'm getting.

RE: Hmm
By mdogs444 on 10/18/2007 9:07:38 AM , Rating: 2
By "HD-less" i meant Hard Drive, not High Def. The $400 version will have 40GB so I cannot imagine a $300 20GB system.

RE: Hmm
By Chaser on 10/18/2007 9:26:22 AM , Rating: 2
I'm not sure if Sony is expects a "victory" by including a Blue Ray player but its undeniable that having a 51GB capacity for gaming content/data is obviously better than the limits of a conventional DVD reader. More is better? And with the pace that storage, memory, flash drives capacities are going its probably a good thing in my view.

RE: Hmm
By Gul Westfale on 10/18/2007 10:04:36 AM , Rating: 2
sony cannot make a hard drive-less version now, because some games use the drive to cache data. also, i'd bet my ass that there are some MMO games in development for the PS3, and those kinds of games need hard drives to store gameworld data. if they made a version without HDD now then it would have serious compatibility issues with existing games.

Broken Strategy Part II
By ChipDude on 10/18/2007 6:12:24 PM , Rating: 3
Funny all those comments about the numbers and not one thought about the significance of the order and how current sales trends will either keep or change the order.

By the way, my numbers were direct from the WSJ this morning and they are US numbers only. Frankly the exact number isn't as important as the overall big picture. Sorry I don't measure the significance of my gamebox by monthly or weekly sales figures. I measure it by how fun it is and how many cool games I got or will be coming.

Bottom line SONY is going to end up in last place here.

360 has largest installed base, Wii second, and PS3 a distant 3rd. Frankly Sony boys like to talk a lot about units shipped. The reason is that the number of actual sold is so low that the big pile of PS3s I see sitting at BestBuy inflates the preceived total number. With the current sales trend Wii is/will soon be the biggest installed base with 360 at second and SONY a very very distant 3rd. Even if PS3 doubles sales which would represent ONE HUNDRED PERCENT increase it won't catch either 360 or WII. What are the chances of a doubling of sales, possible. Even with TWO HUNDRED PERCENT increase in PS3 sales they still won't catch WII and XBBOX360 anytime soon. What are the chance of a two hundred precent sales increase, NIL!!!! Expect with holiday rush the cheaper 360s+ Halo and wider WII availability will make the likelhood that SONY can close the gap NIL. That is SONY's biggest problem being a distant 3rd on consoles on a platform that is expensive and hard to develop games. Low market acceptance, high cost of development = low new games resulting in lower marketing inertia to buy platform. This is a downward spiral SONY has failed to address since their launch!!!

Jack already admitted that PS3 features were before time. Result is billion dollars loses from development for SONY, slow aviability due to poor yield on Cell and blue-ray. Today SONY has conceded that cell is a bust and is giving up their billion + dollar factory for cell to Toshiba. Pretty much admisson that volumes are going to be so low they can't justify their own manufacturing. Now what to do to try and goose sales to convince developers not to give up?

Jack admited that the feature reduction isn't materail to reducing cost. So any increase in sales will be more loss for SONY. Again validating they picked the wrong technology and nobody is willing to pay for it.

Jac admited they removed the backward compatibility to force people to buy PS3 games. Pretty much saying I don't want to leverage my 40 MILLION INSTALLED USERS. Instead I want to try and goose sales by dropping prices and hope I cna convince developers the the increased sales will result into a larger base of game buyers. This is just STUPID! You already don't have the games to convince people to buy your platform, then you junk your very biggest competitive asset which is the 40million users that would probably jump at a 299 or less BR next gen console. Summary missed twice, still too expensive and with the one feature it needed NOT in it. Brilliant SONY, your marketing genious is just a JOKE!

SONY shot one foot off 2 years ago when the picked to include BR and bust the price by 200 bucks. Then they shot their
other foot with the slip in release and refusal to absorb more loss up front for their bad technology bet.
Now they are faced with an unsurmontable marketshare problem that they can't recover. Game developers are already lost, doesn't matter what they did. A year ago if the PS3 was priced at 399 or something you'd see double the market share and momentum would have carried into monthly sales and the whole thing would have fed itself. Gamedevelopers would be going crazy doing PS3 2nd. Now PS3 is 3rd behind WII and xbox360 release. Its a broken cycle.

Sony can drop the price to 299 and it won't change the landscape much. A 50% sales increase by Christmas time is likely with the new price drop but won't be enough to change the overall ranking and thus SONY is still stuck. They will make lots of press about a huge sales increase. But like I said earlier SONY needs a THREE HUNDRED percentage increase in sales and sutained one at that to get to where they need to.

You guys can reject this premise and rate me down, really doesn't matter to me. The fact of the matter this direction was cast two years ago. Sony lost the opportunity to change direction 9 months ago. Now is too late. Chalk this up to Sony arrogance of built it and they WILL come eventually. There is too many choices out there and the difference between xbox360 and PS3 are small enough that PS3 even with a price drop can't recover. They started last and will END LAST.

RE: Broken Strategy Part II
By Murst on 10/19/2007 1:18:50 AM , Rating: 3
You may be right if you're speaking ONLY about the US market, although I wouldn't call it certain at all - far from it, actually.

However, when you look at the whole picture (and that's how these companies evaluate their performance), Sony is doing quite well. I would not be surprised at all if Sony overtook MS in total console sales, simply due to the fact that the 360 isn't selling well at all anywhere outside the Americas. They've been stuck without any real momentum, while Sony has been picking up the pace.

Also, you should keep in mind that sales of the PS3 in the first year are almost identical to the sales of the 360 in its first year. If you're calling the PS3 a failure by looking at the numbers sold, the same could be said for the 360 - and we both know that isn't true.

Just as 2007 has been a great year for MS (lets forget about the RROD, its not really that relevant and people will forget about it 6 months after its fixed anyways), 2008 is shaping to be a huge year for Sony as well. In fact, I think its safe to say that Sony has the most exciting lineup of software announced. Whether it lives up to the hype is another story, but I just can't see anything in Nintendo's or MS's lineup that can match Home, MGS, GT5 and FF.

Finally, please keep in mind that I do think all 3 consoles have amazing games coming out (and each is worth owning... I certainly hope all 3 consoles succeed). Mass Effect for the 360 looks amazing, and its hard to argue that Mario Galaxy and Smash Brother Brawl will not be instant classics. But saying that Sony has failed is far from the truth. It just makes you sound like a MS or Wii fanboy who can't look at what Sony has to offer objectively.

By mikeyD95125 on 10/18/2007 5:51:35 PM , Rating: 2
So the 60GB will be the last PS3 with backwards compatibility?

I was REALLY counting on the 40GB having it. I'm in a pickle now. Just skip the compatibility or run out and buy the 60GB??

Broken Strategy continues by sony!
By ChipDude on 10/18/07, Rating: -1
RE: Broken Strategy continues by sony!
By Chaser on 10/18/2007 10:56:40 AM , Rating: 2
I don't know where you get your numbers from as you didn't list your source.

PS3 sales: 4,890,115

RE: Broken Strategy continues by sony!
By Legionosh on 10/18/2007 11:34:32 AM , Rating: 2
I'm pretty sure he was referring to the US PS3 sales numbers..

..but on the whole his numbers are off. Seems like he picked number for some regions, didn't count others, etc.

..but the PS3 US sales numbers are roughly in the area of what he posted (probably a little higher by now though)..


RE: Broken Strategy continues by sony!
By Murst on 10/18/2007 11:45:25 AM , Rating: 2
Even if his numbers are for the americas, the numbers are wrong.

Current standings (in millions, vgcharts)

Xbox 360: 7.63
Wii: 5.19
PS3: 2.13

By Legionosh on 10/18/2007 11:57:21 AM , Rating: 2
I only said his PS3 numbers referred to the US, and that odds are it was little higher, which your 2.13 million reflects. So I was correct.

I never said that his other numbers jived, as it was obvious (as I stated) that he was counting some regions, not counting others..correct again.

..or maybe he was pulling numbers from a bodily orifice..something I don't want to think about..(hopefully not correct on that)


By ChipDude on 10/18/2007 9:38:18 PM , Rating: 2
Numbers are US sales from WSJ article this morning. You guys get it all wrong. I have no specific interest to elevate WII/xb360.

Like I said before the bigger picture is that Sony is so behind that they have no case to take to the game developers to put extra effort. Now they shoot themselves by dropping backward compatible to 40million + installed users...

Oh.. WSJ = Wall Street Journal ... can't assume intelligence here I see.

RE: Broken Strategy continues by sony!
By Murst on 10/18/2007 11:34:03 AM , Rating: 2
According to vgcharts,

(in millions)
Wii: 12.42
Xbox: 11.84
PS3: 5.07

RE: Broken Strategy continues by sony!
By Legionosh on 10/18/2007 12:00:48 PM , Rating: 2
Those number are probably pretty accurate (although I always read every sales chart with a grain of salt..just in case..)

..but with the Wii dropping off badly in Japan (from 100,000 a week to 20,000..ouch) and the 360 sales going up (not necessarily in due to all the major AAA titles out now or out for the holiday season I am curious to see the standings closer to or right after the holidays.


RE: Broken Strategy continues by sony!
By Murst on 10/18/2007 1:24:08 PM , Rating: 2
The only reason I posted those numbers is because it appeared like he was inflating the 360 numbers while lowering the wii/ps3 numbers. There's really no reason to do that.

RE: Broken Strategy continues by sony!
By murphyslabrat on 10/18/2007 1:36:57 PM , Rating: 2
It's amazing how four different people can cite different figures. Mayhaps, if people bothered to check for current numbers...

RE: Broken Strategy continues by sony!
By Murst on 10/18/2007 2:14:10 PM , Rating: 2
And that's why its always good to include the source of the numbers.

I thought it was pretty clear the numbers I provided came from vgcharts.

By Legionosh on 10/18/2007 1:45:07 PM , Rating: 2
That's fair enough (I hate it when people do that also).

..and I agree, no real need to falsify numbers just to make ones self feel just makes said person look like a schmoo in the end.


By clovell on 10/18/2007 2:50:29 PM , Rating: 2
Leverage their base? They've done that. They'd also spent a lot of money making a good product, that's floundering out in the marketplace. What Sony needs to do is get some more market penetration before their devs start getting cold feet - or worse - jumping ship.

And, that, requires PS3's to be sold - not PS2's or BC. Without devs, PS3 will fail, and without market penetration, devs will slowly back down & eventually out.

"The whole principle [of censorship] is wrong. It's like demanding that grown men live on skim milk because the baby can't have steak." -- Robert Heinlein

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